I really enjoyed last night’s performance of Habima’s The Merchant of Venice at The Globe on the south bank of the River Thames on a beautiful summer evening in London.
The cast received a prolonged standing ovation at the end (see above). The Globe was the perfect setting with its open roof allowing you to peer into the ever darkening sky as the constant movement of small planes readied you for the inevitable interruptions.
My main concerns were whether I would follow a play in Hebrew and whether the interruptions would ruin the experience, but two small screens kept us nicely updated in English and The Globe’s security knew when to act and when not to.
Security removed protesters swiftly so limiting the disruption but they allowed a very weird protest, where six protesters stood silently on the first balcony for virtually the entire first half with their lips taped up, to proceed.
First protest during last night’s show.
Second protest during last night’s show.
The performance itself brought to the fore the comedy of The Merchant of Venice with a humourous gondola impression each time the action transferred to Venice, reminiscent of a sideways Moonwalk.
Seeing Shylock dispossessed of everything when Antonio’s defence lawyer finds a loophole in his contract with Shylock and watching Shylock forced to convert to Christianity to escape going to prison himself was maybe a Shakespearian premonition of the treatment in store for the Jews of Europe and Arab countries in the centuries to come.
In all there were some 20 protesters and I recognised two of them straight off.
Peter Scott recently tried to have me arrested and charged with harassment for doing nothing more than photographing him for my blog holding a Palestinian flag at an anti-Israel protest. Last night he donned a smart Panama hat. When I noticed him during the interval I pointed him out to security who, again, did nothing.
I went out to get a drink but when I came back two friends said that a man wearing a Panama had just been removed by security after he had approached them to discuss the disturbances. As they were talking to him they noticed he was wearing an electronic recording device on his lapel. Here is Scott during the interval:
I saw the following protester going into The Globe last night and when I called his name he looked round. I then called security but he made haste away from me until he was eventually caught by security and, out of breathe and shaking, gave a butter-wouldn’t-melt-in-my-mouth look.
I felt traumatised that I might have unjustly accused an innocent person and ruined his evening, but just before the interval he did unfurl a banner and was removed by security:
The protester about to be removed by Globe security last night.
Meanwhile, the foyer was packed with police dealing with the protesters. In the top left corner here you can spot ubiquitous anti-Zionist activist Tony Greenstein:
Outside The Globe the Zionist Federation and Stand With Us had arranged a pro-Israel protest. There was also a pen for Palestine Solidarity Campaign activists. One PSC man had donned a mask with a big nose, but swore it wasn’t an anti-Semitic gesture.
I asked some of the PSC lot whether they saw the recent production of Richard II by the Palestinian theatre company also at The Globe. They said they didn’t as it was a matinee and they had work commitments. They must have conveniently failed to spot the Saturday performance at 7.30pm then; proof, if ever it was needed, that PSC activists don’t give a damn about the Palestinians.
Habima is expecting another packed house tonight and many thanks should be paid to The Globe, its security and the police for allowing the show to go on despite the efforts of those with ignorant views.
Meanwhile, the London Evening Standard described last night’s performance by Habima as “a tricky evening triumphantly negotiated” and The Times said it was “an evening to remember for reasons of art as well as politics”.
Photos from outside The Globe last night:
This is not an anti-Semitic gesture by a PSC comrade, apparently.
Having fun outside The Globe.
Sweet.
Precisely.
RichardMillett's Blog 
Take that Emma Thompson!
“They must have conveniently failed to spot the Saturday performance at 7.30pm”
Or maybe because many are Jews (Greenstein et al) and Shabbat wasn’t out until 9:30pm
Yeah I’m sure they’re all observant Jews, especially Greenstein.
Well done for documenting and photographing this, Richard. Duvidl was outside with the Zionist Federation and Stand With Us at the pro-Israel protest. It was great fun singing and dancing in the sunshine to chalutzic Israeli songs. It must have been lovely for you too in the open air on a sunny evening.
Duvidl did not spot any famous faces, but we were addressed very cogently by a Baroness MEP, whose name Duvidl cannot remember, who said the BDS people had certainly picked the wrong target in Habima, a freedom-loving national theatre group. The Baroness said this wasnothing unusual, since they had also picked the wrong target in this country’s educational system and universities. A ZF or Stand With Us speaker also said BDS would need to forgo a number of products from Israel, including computer messaging systems, Intel chips for computers, Motorola mobile phones and voicemail systems. Luckily, Duvidl has no intention of communicating with them as you have, Richard.
Richard gave Me a spare ticket ( Thanks Mate ) – so I was able to go to the performance .
Habima were completely unfazed by the attempted disruptions from the Extremists – They carried on with courage & professionalism – I was so proud of Habima & the wonderful audience Who supported Them .
I had a really nice evening & came away from it with new ideas to think about – and really that is the point of Artistic Expression in a Democratic Society .
Kol Hakavod Habima !!!
Looks like a great event, except for the protestors. One day all people, bizrat hashem, will appreciate good art and musical performances in the Holy Land without politics getting in the way.
I’m sure Shakespeare would approve of such a scene unfolding.
Do you people really think this London inter cult squabble shatters any earth ?
And as for Shakespeare approving I am sure the profoundly anti semitic Shakespeare would be laughing his head off.
The mask worn by the protester appears to be that of Pantalone, a miserly merchant– the character originated more as a stereotype of Venetian (and nominally Catholic) merchants, given the exaggerated nose and the fact that the play being performed inside is The Merchant of Venice it’s quite unlikely that it isn’t meant to evoke Shylock and other anti-Semitic imagery as opposed to an making an allusion to Shakespeare’s indebtedness to Italian comedy.
So sorry I was unable to attend, but happy to have passed my ticket on via Richard.
It seems the evening was a great success all round. My thanks goes to Emma Thomson and her luvies for being prey to the propaganda about Israel and the BDS/PSC who publicised this event so well. For sure this Shakespeare festival would only have attracted enthusiasts and maybe a few Israelis, but following the Jew haters attempting to coerce the world to join their hideous activities, Habima played to a packed audience with people grappling for tickets when none were to be found.
So, thank you Jew haters for making the Habima theatre group world famous – no amount of money could have purchased such publicity! Own goal? May there many more.
Well done to everyone involved in this story – except for the anti-Israel activists of course. Kudos to the Globe for inviting Habima and then sticking to their invitation despite the immense peer pressure that was brought to bear upon them. Also to their security personnel. Kol hakavod to Habima for what sounds like an excellent performance. And yasher koach to all the pro-Israel activists who stood up to the BSD-ers.
I wish i could have been there to enjoy it all.
Well done Richard. At least in this gig were you were with many friends
Yep Richard. Michael is so right. It must have felt great to be with like minded people and not the sole sane person sitting in a hall full of crazies and Jew haters!
Well done Richard as always for being there and documenting it all. Also, good point Sharon about Emma Thompson turning this from an also ran into a tremendous success.
Turned up for the second night’s protest outside tonight, which was pretty low key but were accosted by one of the haters, who wanted to ‘talk to us’, saying it was ok because he was Jewish.
Muppet didn’t realise one of our number was a Holocaust survivor and would have no truck with a ‘kapo’. I too was somewhat less than complimentary – just as well for us both the police were there in strength.
If last night was a bds fail , then tonight was a simply epic fail . No protest in the galleries this time , and those few in the pit were muted and dealt with efficiently . To say it was pathetic would be an understatement .
Bruce Levy was the last to be turfed out . I hadn’t realised just how short he is and with a freshly shaven head as a disguise , it was not a pretty sight .
At the interval last night , I literally bumped into Greenstein as he was trying to quietly re enter the yard . Once rumbled , he went berserk . Screaming his absurdities and trying to rush in . However this prompted three security guys who were built like the proverbial brick outhouse , to pile in on him . They had him in an armlock and the last I saw of him was being surrounded by a number of policemen . He had a bizarre rictus grin and he looked like he was on ‘medication ‘
He really is a wretched non entity . I gather Atzmon has bern giving him a going over on Greensteins blog. With supporters like these two, the Palestinians have no chance.
Thank you very much Richard for passing on a ticket. Just in case people didn’t pick up on this – probably most did – the mask is similar to some worn by the cast. You would think that even if he wore it innocently he would *want* to take it off once someone had made him think about that connotation.
I don’t know what you all are gloating about, this looks ridiculous to me. When people undertake these kinds of demonstrations, there is no such thing as failure unless you fail to get into the papers. At least, that’s the American way. Seems to me, they succeeded in bringing to the attention of millions of people who hadn’t been aware that there was an issue, that there indeed was one. Interrupting the performance would have been a trifling bonus. If Israeli artists can now only perform with the aide of unprecedented security measures that they got at the Globe because it WAS the Globe, which they would not get in most places, is this not now a very slippery slope? Reminds me of Bill Clinton and the infamous cigar…forever linked in history.
You have it wrong American Princess , Jewish or otherwise . Habimah at the globe demonstrated several incontrovertible facts .
First and foremost is that Habimah are welcome in the Uk as are all Israeli cultural , sporting , economic , academics , politicians etc . When I say welcome , I mean welcome by the government of the Uk . The people and organisations who have declared that Israel alone among all nations is simply beyond the pale do not represent her Majesty’s government . Nor do they represent the views of the goverrnments of any first world democratic country in the Eu , Australasia , north America Russia and China .
They do however represent the views of totalitarian dictatorships of the Arab Middle East and Iran . States which have shown a total disregard for the lives of their own citizens . Murderous , barbaric regimes that also single out Israel for dismantlement by all means at their disposal .
That is why Finklestein labeled the Bds a cult . They seek the total eradication of Israel as an independent Jewish nation . No country outside the Arab and Iranian nexus would tolerate such an objective and nor would the vast majority of their citizens .
So the bds / psc remains a cult without a semblance of any political traction . Just so many talking heads and fanatics who cannot tolerate their exposure by Richard Milletts camera .
You also need to understand that the psc is systemically antisemitic .
They have to conduct EGMs in order to expel their holocaust deniers but with some 20% voting against expulsion . But it doesn’t need a vote to tell us that
Their mantra Palestine will be free from river to the sea renders them 100 % antisemitic .
As for expense , it’s a price worth paying to ensure the unique diaspora relationship with Israel . If not , it means acquiescence to racist , antisemitic gutter snipes
And that will never happen .
Nobody gives a damn about those spamming, screeching, mumbling idiots. You think the “Palestinian” cause needs any more publicity? Seriously? As if you haven’t had enough? Your cause has had all the publicity you could ever want over the last three years. Now you’ve blown it. People are sick of you lot and they’re sick of your Jew hating cause. The more you bleat on about it the more the public rejects you. That’s why they called you SCUM at the Globe – because that’s what you are. Fascist scum, marching through Jewish areas of London preaching hatred and stealth Jihad. You lot are no different to the BNP marching through Muslim areas. All you want is trouble and attention. You’ve had both and it’s got you nowhere. What will you do now? Join Hamas? Or how about Assad’s death squads?
All you and your fellow travellers achieved was to give great publicity to Habima and look like disruptive and obsessive fools, yet again, just as you did with the IPO.
(Richard – THANK YOU)
RIGHT ON Matt, London!
Look your parochial inter cult squabbles entertain me but don’t interest me in the same way something relevant would interest me. But this might strike some as relevant.
The 1981 South African rugby tour of New Zealand was a turning point in the anti apartheid campaign. The tour succeeded in that after the first match, following which the New Zealand govt was stung into action, every game was completed. The entire resources of the state were thrown in to make sure the games were completed. So you could say that the demonstrators failed. But they would say that they succeeded. The springboks never left apartheid South Africa again.
Further Muldoon was very soon afterwards thrown out of office by a landslide and the tour was much to blame. The apartheid springboks were ALWAYS welcome by govts. That is irrelevant. They ceased to be welcome by the people. This was a slow process. I think that JAP’s point is that making people aware that there is a problem is an early stage in the process.( Do bear in mind that thinking is my strong point )
“Look your parochial inter cult squabbles entertain me but don’t interest me in the same way something relevant would interest me.”
Then might I suggest you f*ck off and comment on things that do interest you, like kiddie porn or Jihadi beheading videos?
Matt I would much rather be entertained than interested. Thanks for playing your part.
Seriously, Rich, go and do something constructive than coming here just to bully decent people.
Talking of constructive Richard I remain an optimist. I still have the perhaps naive hope that Israel will mend its ways and quit forcibly extending itself beyond its internationally recognised frontiers. Then we might have a two states for two people solution. Or do you share Harvey’s view that this is an illusion ?
for crying out loud, stop that border nonsense – even Germany and the Netherlands still have unsolved border issues aka not internationally recognized mutual borders.
Not every body lives on an island and more important some people, even those whose strong points are thinking, manage to imagine that there are border issues non-island countries have to deal with which are completely alien to islanders with isolationist one-track-mind.
rich, This July 7th is the seventh anniversary of your “heroic” islamofascists attack on London transport.
TGIAI I ordinarlly wouldn’t respond to such stuff, but for your information…..That was a very bad day for me. My daughter was caught up in that in the sense that she was spending the day on the south bank and we lost communication and she couldn’t get out of London. For five hours we didn’t know….But hey I can take it. I long since learned to always consider the source, and just roll with it.
If what say this tit who calls himself rich is true about his daughter then his love for everything anti Israel is twisted and sick, even worse than the image he portrayed of himself before this anecdote. It shows either a total lack of knowledge or a coward who would rather there wasn’t an Israel in the idiotic hope that it it’ll never happen to his daughter again. More fool him because all this hatred is not anti Israel, it is not about borders, it is not about the suppression of Arabs, it IS about the very existence of Jews, not only in Israel, but at all. (for that I suggest a reading list that includes the Koran, Bernard Lewis, Bat Ye’or, Ibn Warraq, Robert Spencer, Ayaan Hirsi Ali for starters, all of whom know a little bit more about the subject than the Guardian, Independent, BBC and all the other MSM combined. And before he jumps tomaccuse me of not understanding the pain such terrorist attacks can cause, my daughter was working in the Israeli embassy in London when terrorists blew it up (and yes do a quick Google as he probably didn’t read the one article that appeared in th MSM about it) and one of her close school friends was killed on 7/7. That is why we have to understand what is at stake. There is no room for error here, or false sense of righteousness. As Jews we know how to be and all this claptrap propaganda is simply contrived by our detractors to deligitimisation us, the Jewish people using Israel as the target to avoid breaking their own laws against so called race hate. And the worse thing of all is that there are Jews amongst them, a collective Judas.
Of course, the comparison between the BDS movement and the anti-Apartheid movement of the 1980s is ridiculous. The BDS movement has trouble not sinking into racist imagery and rhetoric nor is it able to articulate itself cause without delving into anti-Semitic pseudo-history or advocating an anti-Semitic agenda or otherwise making common cause with anti-Semites.
The anti-Apartheid movement, on the other hand, was largely free of racism and the African National Congress always articulated a vision of a post-Apartheid South Africa would still be a home for white South Africans.
That wasn’t the point Ian. I am no fan of BDS I remain an optimist. The point was a general one about how such protest movements evolve.
And Richard someone that ” signed ” a petition designed to humiliate Dan Sheldon and bully him out of office merely for speaking the obvious truth, is not well placed to talk about bullying.
I signed that petition in error. I signed it from my phone and not reading it in full I genuinely thought it was a petition just to condemn a statement he made. At no stage did I wish him to lose any position. As soon as I saw him at an event I apologised to him about signing it. I found it impossible to remove my signature after I had signed it in error.
What petitions people sign or don’t sign are none of this creep’s business. He’s a stalker and a troll.
“I am no fan of BDS”
He’s also a liar, because if he opposed the racist, fascist, Jihadist BDS cult then he would be helping you to confront them instead of haranguing you about things that are none of his business. He supports them, even if he’s too cowardly to admit it.
Jonny boy that was not nice.
Silverstein used to support BDS until it became too embarrassing to do so publicly, which is why he has to now do so under a nom-de-guerre. He still supports their aims which are the equivalent to forcing South Sudan to cede more land to Sudan or forcing the Kurdish north of Iraq to cede more land to Arab Iraq. He also supports their methods which involve marching with gangs of Islamists through Jewish communities in London.
My name is not Jonny Boy, my name is Matt. I would give you my address to prove it but I don’t fancy finding a bomb under my car or having my kids shot. You colossal wanker.
Fair enough Richard.
And Jonny boy my position is clear and unambiguous and I state it fearlessly unlike you.
Rich Armbach’s position…..
Israel is a state. It exists, like any other state as a matter of fact not as a matter of right. It makes no sense to talk of a states right to exist except in the context of a closed system, eg a system of law. The world has moved on from conquer, annexe, colonise, grown up just a little you might say.
Israel has internationally recognised borders. Nowadays states are expected to impose themselves by force outside of their internationally recognised borders and the civilised ones don’t. If Israel were to come into line with this civilised practice and quit behaving like a rogue state, I would have no issue with it. Problem solved.
Your turn Jonny boy.
“Israel has internationally recognised borders.”
I think you’re somewhat confused.
Between 1949 and 1967 there were “internationally recognised” armistice lines… which the surrounding Arab countries refused to respect. They also refused to hold negotiations with Israel to establish agreed-to borders.
After the 6 Day War Israel tried to negotiate again (“land for peace”). If you haven’t heard of the Khartoum “Three No’s” then I suggest you google it.
rich, you say that “Israel has internationally recognised borders.” Really? So when did Hamas, Hizbollah, Syria, Fata, Iran, etc, recognise them?
” to not impose themselves…. ” that should read
waiting patiently to be called a pisher
I have never come across a more arrogant ignorant fool like this idiot who runs with the name rich. I really don’t know why you justify yourself to this nincompoop Richard. He has nothing constructive to contribute to life so who cares who he supports or not. He is too thick skinned to grasp that.
No cba I think it is you that is confused. Read Moshe Dayans biography page 117 the Rhodes agreements. They were agreed as BORDERS.Dayan WAS THERE. Read Ben Gurion’s reflections on the matter. The State of Israel was recognised by the UN. Are you telling us the UN recognised a borderless state ? When was the last time they did that ? You people are a hoot.
I think the point being made is that fully half of the combatants involved i.e. Israel’s enemies, including the Palestinians, didn’t recognise them as borders, at least not permanent ones. Israel had already had to enlarge her borders because her enemies didn’t recognise those of the UNSCOP partition plan.
Are there any other UN recognised borderless states ? Dear God .
Keep your suggestions to yourself cba they just make you look stupid.
Pot. Kettle. Eternal Nakba.
I did of course mean Dayans autobiography ” The Story of my life ”
Page 117 fucking read it.
Rich, it doesn’t matter what you think. If Israel wasn’t in the West Bank Tel Aviv would be pounded by rockets. As much as you couldn’t give a damn about that Israelis do. When the Palestinians want to talk a serious peace and not the obliteration of Israel then the so-called settlements can come down just like they did in Gaza. Until then Israel is in the West Bank both legally and defensively. If you feel so strongly make aliyah and win hearts and minds and then change government policy.
Until then Israel is in the West Bank both legally and defensively.
Unfortunately Richard the whole world and its canary disagrees with you.
As usual, when utterly unable to understand someone else’s point of view, the ubiquitous anti-Zionist / Islamist / Golden Dawn / Stormfront drone that calls himself “rich” claims that he must be right because the “whole world” thinks exactly like him, which is of course the typical mentality of all fascists and totalitarians.
Whats up Jonny boy was Morrrigan Emaleth already taken ?
Yes, Richard – that’s just what we need, another idiot.
Rich, your role in the struggle for whatever you’re struggling for – Philistines for Palestine – is crucially important and it is imperative that you stay wherever you happen to be.
Daniel
I know you to be the last person to be in need of additional ammunition, nonetheless I can’t resist recommending this to your and everybody’s attention. Really amazing, so it doesn’t start with silly TV-programs or lying school books, so who loves life and who loves death starts with national anthems.
http://www.treppenwitz.com/2012/05/their-longing-and-ours.html
PS: “They” certainly aren’t kind in the sense Agatha Christie defined it for me.
ouch or is it yyyyyaaaawwwwwnnnn
I have yet to come across a more ignorant Jew-hating wanker. The Green Line was not an ‘international border’.
Duvid, the Libdem ( yes, I was surprised too!) MEP was Baroness Sarah Ludford- I asked for her card. It was wonderful doing simcha dancing in a summery London street- some highlights:
As it was the second day of Shavuot, there were fewer Jewish counterdemo people but more by non Jewish people of a rainbow spectrum of diversity, who unlike the other side, were not just screeching the usual slogans but discussing informatively the issues. When a British woman of African heritage draped in huge Union and Israeli flags began to dance in the street in front of our pen, a number of us women joyously joined in and kept going for the duration.
By contrast, the anti peace, Israel haters were a thin straggle and had no public address system. I went over to engage a young woman in hijab carrying an Israel apartheid banner and to discuss from my own experience the apartheid issue. She was interested and was asking me about the wisdom of her Uni of East London’s invitation to Winnie Mandela to Black History month as there was opposition among some of her colleagues.I was able to talk from my experience in being on Winnie’s defence team during the Struggle.
I asked her what she thought of Saudi apartheid in barring women participants to the Olympics and she was against that discrimination and said she had signed a petition about that.
We were getting along fine but the Jewish members of the picket, with their monomaniacal obsession could not bear that we were straying from the message, and kept screeching interjections, yelling “Why are you speaking about Saudi Arabia, why are you discussing this or that.”
It is all ego and a totalitarian mindset. Not only do they want to censor the performance, but to censor even their comrades whose attention strays from the cause for a moment:
They are so patriarchal and patronising and only see people like the young woman as cannon fodder to promote their own boiling toxic issues, and cannot bear not to be in control of the conversation.
In this review
https://blogs.warwick.ac.uk/pkirwan/entry/the_merchant_of_1_2_3_4_5/
IN the 3rd photo down, the man in the fancy dress red hat with the poster reading “the play is not the thing in Ariel” was one of those patriarchal types screeching at me and not wanting to let the hijab young woman speak for herself. He claimed to have been in the cultural boycott campaign in SA back in the day. Anyone know him?
Thank you for this lovely comment which I enjoyed reading immensely.
Peter Kirwan’s review, that Amie links to, is very depressing, and some of the comments that follow it even more so. For a commenter (number 38 Steve) to say ‘If Zionism is Judaism, then antisemitism is a moral imperative’ reveals the utter moral bankruptcy to which some anti-Zionists have sunk.
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Cheer up Ric.
70 years ago they were gassing us or burying us alive. Six years later they were trying to drive us into the sea before Israel was even declared.
Today they write silly comments instead. We’ve come a long way and we’ve got a lot of which to be proud. They’ve changed little, but fortunately they are weaker than they’ve ever been, so they disrupt Habima a bit and then get kicked out.
Shabbat shalom
Ric Cooper, yes that Kirwan is so precious poor diddums:
“I have never felt quite so intimidated, tense and uncomfortable at the behaviour of people around me as I did tonight at the Globe, and it was the aggressive interventions of the non-protesters rather than the protests themselves that prompted most of these feelings.”
As I commented elsewhere, Kirwan appears to have led a sheltered life- let him spend some time in Richard’s shoes, confronting and challenging hate filled SOAS platforms with like minded audiences, and see what intimidation really feels like.
Gulp OK I’m signing up to the Richard Millet Preservation Society. Such a delicate flower in such a cruel world. Amie you have sold me.
rich, you say that “Israel has internationally recognised borders.” Really? So when did Hamas, Hizbollah, Syria, Fata, Iran, etc, recognise them?
I didnt say universally recognised. Recognised by the overwhelming majority of the worlds nations and by the UN. Where is etc located ?
“Where is etc located ?” Oh rich, you’re so funny. I bet all your friends on the tossers for terrorists forum wet their pants laughing at that one. Or was it just a damp stain?
Anyway, back in the adult world, we worry about the not so small number of states and organisations that don’t recognise Israel’s right to exist, let alone any borders. You see, we don’t need to waste time discussing our borders with anyone who recognises them, when we can use that time combating the terrorists who don’t recognise them and are trying to kill our children.
You do understand this basic reality don’t you?
In a characteristically articulate yet succinct manner “Leah” effectively refutes the contention that the Green Line constitutes Israel’s internationally recognized border with the tenderly crafted:
“I have yet to come across a more ignorant Jew-hating wanker. The Green Line was not an ‘international border’.”
I could not but recall the story is often told how on the day after his Gettysburg Address Abraham Lincoln was praised by Edward Everett who famously wrote, “I should be glad if I could flatter myself that I came as near to the central idea of the occasion, in two hours, as you did in two minutes.” Though it is not wholly clear to whom the comment was intended, how many commentators on this excellent blog are able to synthesize empty-headedness, antisemitism and a disposition autoeroticism?
Regarding substance, the point could not be more precise. The “Green Line was not the border of partition, but the ceasefire lines arising from the War of Independence. Contrary to nonsense that has been posted on this blog, the Rhodes Agreements not only don’t define Israel’s political border with Jordan, but say so in as many words:
“It is also recognized that no provision of this Agreement shall in any way prejudice the rights, claims and positions of either Party hereto in the ultimate peaceful settlement of the Palestine question, the provisions of this Agreement being dictated exclusively by military considerations.”
The “Palestinian People” were not a party to the accords in any way. In fact they were only officially invented 15 years later in 1964.
In mentioning the “Palestine question” the term is used as a geographical definition of the remaining 24% of the areas of the British Mandate, after Trans-Jordan had been given away.
The word Palestine is alien to both Hebrew and Arabic, in fact, most “Palestinians” are unable to even pronounce the word as there is no P sound in Arabic.
The Rhodes Agreements were written at a time when many Jews living in Eretz Israel still had passports issued by His Majesty’s government saying “Palestinian”, the English-speakers among them read the (Zionist) Palestine Post and their generous brothers abroad would continue contributing to the Joint Palestine Appeal (which only changed its name in 1973).
Returning to the Rhodes Agreement Israel has had no border dispute with Jordan since 1994 when a peace treaty was signed the two countries. Similarly, Israel also has no border dispute with her Southern neighbor Egypt. With both countries Israel has internationally recognized borders.
Regarding Syria, Israel would very much like to negotiate an agreement of peace, prosperity and good neighborliness, sadly however, it appears that the Assad regime is currently preoccupied with massacring its own civilians. We comfort ourselves that even if we had peace, Damascus would hardly be an ideal tourist destination for the sun-loving Israeli holiday maker of Summer 2012!
Maybe Bridlington-on-Sea? I hear the bingo is excellent.
Thank you for the good bits, ruined as usual by the stupid bits generated by your delusion that you are terribly witty (and by your delusion that my name isn’t Leah).
Reading the thread itself makes clear to whom my comment was addressed.
Leah, I read Daniel’s post as praise and support of your reply to rich. And I think both your posts were funny. Keep up the good work please.
Hopelessly irrelevant. The British foreign offiice recognises the State of Israel as delineated on Atlases. Beyond are The Occupied Palestinian Territories. This is the position of virtually every govt in the world, and the UN. You can say this shouldn’t be the case. You can say you don’t give a fuck we prefer to live as shameless thieves rather than as civilised people of a civilised nation What you can’t sensibly say is that these aren’t Irael’s internationally recognised frontiers
Also irrelevant as Israel doesn’t recognize those territories as Israel either.
But mostly irrelevant since it has nothing to do with Habima’s appearance in London.
Hi Tom,
Well it’s nice of you to take off time to tell us what we can say and what we can’t, but as a sovereign state governed by a democratically elected government, you’ll understand if we take you thoughtful advice with just a pinch of that proverbial salt.
Regarding what you say about atlases, if it is correct, it mainly means that their mapping is as accurate as your spelling and capital letter usage.
I’m not going to even bother asking you what you’re doing about the tens of Syrians killed every day 100km from where I’m sitting, because I know that any Arab being killed by another Arab interests you as much as correct English grammar.
So instead, I’ll tell you that in ten minutes I begin class with, among other Israeli students, two Arab Israeli girls called Sali and Hind from Abu Gosh.
Abu Gosh is in the center of Israel and there you’ll find the ones who never tried to destroy us or drive us into the sea. They know exactly where Israel is on the map as do their families in the neighboring Arab countries. Israeli Arabs are the only Arabs in the whole Middle East who enjoy living in a genuine democracy and they’re the envy of their cousins abroad.
So put that in your pipe and smoke it or if you like erase us from your little map or stick pins in a Voodoo doll of me. I’ll still be here – and I’m having a ball.
I don’t see any advice just a statement of certain facts. Tom is me I ballsed up. The info boxes were pre loaded with the details of the last person to use the computer to post on a wordpress blog and I didn’t notice ha ha ha. The argument wasn’t about what Arabs are best off where merely to restate that Israel has internationally recognised borders. Itake it you are saying you don’t give a fuck and live like a shameless thief. Thats cool.
“You can say……. You can say………What you can’t sensibly say is that………….” –
“I don’t see any advice…….” – Rich
Having trouble relating to the clear and simple logic of my writing you prefer to produce an infantile badly worded obscenity and “take it (sic)” to be what I am saying.
I can well sympathize with your preference for debating your own imaginary version of that which you’d like me to be saying, rather than contemplating the daunting intellectual task of relating to what I have actually said. Truthfully, if I were you, I’d be arguing with myself too. After all, you are far and away the easiest anti-Zionist to beat on this excellent blog. I had thought that Gert was bad, but your writing makes his “cut and paste” claptrap look like Pulitzer Prize material.
Who knows maybe you don’t really exist. Perhaps you were just invented by the Zionist Federation or the Israeli Foreign Ministry to make us look clever.
Tell me the truth Rich, have you ever persuaded anyone about anything?
you first …………look their is no argument here. That Israel has internationally recognised borders is disputable only by …..hang on give me a mo….. If your response is I don’t give a fuck. Then fine. What is there to argue about ? You will go your way I will go mine. And in 5000 million years the sun will leave its main sequence. What price then ” eternal Israel ” ? There will only then be the misery your racism has caused. And THAT is eternal. THAT is an experience. And experience used to be called the soul.
What utter claptrap. Get a brain rich.
You think I am here to persuade anyone of anything ? You are dumber than you look.
I have no idea what you’re talking about. It’s not a question of agreeing or not. Your writing is all over the place and full of mistakes.
Decide exactly what you want to say, and endeavor to condense it into a single clear sentence. Next, determine how you wish to express that idea. Then simply type out your posting.
Read it over, and ask yourself if it is legible. Please keep your language clean, as I am not in the habit of talking to guttersnipes. Now you are ready to post your comment.
PS
If you’ve had a few drinks or have indulged in some manner of illegal substances, you may wish to sleep it off before making a bit of a fool of yourself again, as in the above “comment”.
You are saying Rich is a Zionistic invenchen? Is this true Rich?
Gamil are we talking a coherence or a corresondence theory of truth here ?
Rich.
You are the Zionist dog and also ‘were just invented by the Zionist Federation or the Israeli Foreign Ministry to make Zionists look clever.’
You are not representing the Palestinian People or glorios popular struggles.
I am spiting on your mustashe!
All the best,
Gamil
Funny you should turn up right now Gamil . I met a camel in the Jordan Valley once. My experience persuades me that you give them a bum rap. No sexual innuendo intended.
ok Daniel I am ready. You hear voices in your head which you take to be God telling you all, and more, is yours. I can’t compete with that.
“The Straw Man fallacy is committed when a person simply ignores a person’s actual position and substitutes a distorted, exaggerated or misrepresented version of that position.”
In hundreds, perhaps thousands, of comments I have never claimed to hear “voices in my head”. My position is simple and wholly rational, but because you cannot deal with what I have said, you substitute a bizarre position of your own. I am an Orthodox Jew and together with 80-90% of those alive on earth today I do believe in the existence of G-d. Naturally, I respect the minority views of those who are atheists, agonists, etc. None of that is in any way connected to the resolution of the Arab Israeli conflict or the meaning of the Rhodes Agreements or even the hundred or so innocent Syrians who were massacred yesterday – a matter you have yet to condemn.
You claim to have studied philosophy and to have (have had) a Jewish father. Unfortunately neither your parents nor your lecturers have left you with even the most rudimentary precepts of Judaism. I have no intention of taking their place and there are many excellent books and sites that might give acquire some basic understanding of these matters.
In a nutshell, Judaism and Jewish law are not derived from hearing voices, never have been and never will be. We have neither phantoms nor ghosts and our sages teach us that since the destruction of the temple prophecy was given only to fools and babies (Bava Batra). Naturally, this is to be taken figuratively.
Any Jew or gentile that hears voices in his head talking to him might do well to check that he has not left his earphone in, and if the trouble persists, to visit his GP.
Since Buddhism is strong in densely populated Asia I’d like to contest your 80/90 % estimate, but that is just me nitpicking in “revenge” for agonists (LOL)
But on this occasion a technical question – according to this Muhammed Ali’s grandson is Jewish because he has a Jewish father – I understand that would entitle him to Israeli citizenship but wouldn’t he have to convert to become a Jew by religious rules?
http://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2012/06/mazel-tov-to-muhammad-alis-grandson-on-his-bar-mitzvah/258155/
and if so, why wouldn’t Goldberg who is currently hailed as most eminent/ultimate sage of whatever say so?
Here’s the piece that gave me that idea:
http://nymag.com/print/?/news/features/peter-beinart-2012-6/
(BTW the still hail Beinart as a great writer – I read his piece that created the brouhaha re young Jews in the US – if he is a great writer standards for that must be very low by now)
Yes, you may be right Silke. I read that number a few years ago. I guess one would have to define what belief in G-d means. There’s a story of a Jew who tells a rabbi that he doesn’t believe in G-d because he finds it hard to believe that there’s an old man with a long beard who watches all our actions, looks after us always, punishes our sins and rewards our good deeds. The rabbi answers, “If that’s what you call G-d, I don’t believe in him either.”
I think our first chat was about the spelling of the word G-d. I’m glad we’ve stayed friends.
Affectionately,
Daniel
PS
That was a disgusting racist comment that Rich made to Gamil. No surprises there.
Daniel
as to rich’s answer to Gamil you shattered my last hope that I may not have understood it correctly.
As to Buddhists I find attractive their apparent lack of imagining God in whatever shape since that particular need always strikes me as being somewhat hubristic and when it comes to the naturallistically depicted Jesus on the cross, nails and all, that we get forced to look at with reverence from earliest childhood on as a minimum outright cruel, the more so since they seem inaccurate to me. One couldn’t have fixed anybody on the cross for any length of time with only those nails.
But then I think about Buddhists that they do imagine God in a way by trying to achieve to experience Nothing (das Nichts in German translation).
As to God or G-d I remember that that particular talk we had, ended unconclusively. If it doesn’t offend you I’d prefer to continue to spell God the way that is common where I come from. Switching to do it your way would make me suspect myself of trying to suck up (einschleimen in German). BTW as best I remember I asked that spelling question “inspired” by oh so multiculturally savvy Gert.
That remark of rich was of course really a thing (ein Dingens in spoken German) and makes me fear that Gamil will now be even less forthcoming in answering my questions about camel recipes.
I wasn’t aware that we were talking about Judaism here. I was talking about you.
Do try to be just a touch less ridiculous Daniel. Gamil is a spoof. A very funny one at that. He kills me. He probly is some smart Irish Catholic kid from West Cork.
I just went into Rymans for some paper and a small globe on sale had no mention of �Palestine� or �the Occupied Territories�.
Richard
Good news from me also !
I have a small globe which alas doesn’t tell me its manufacturer, which has no Judäa and Samaria and no Gaza either and tells me that Jerusalem is the capital of Israel, in short the manufacturer must be a very sane person or entity.
I’ve always considered it to be an especially nice little globe (I once bought it to better get a feel for where Iraq is placed).
Lets hope yours and mine are not from the same manufacturer but that it is a sign that sanity will become fashionable again.
Alas, I have no globe though I’ve noticed that on many of them the name Israel is written somewhere in the ocean. I put this down more to our minute size than any evil globe-maker’s wishful thinking.
Returning to that now infamous British Foreign Ministry globe, over which the sun never sets, have they recognized the USA yet?
You wilfully miss the point Daniel. They use the same globe as just about every country in the world. Including the US.
Well, that’s pretty damn worrying – just kidding!
Here’s another globe-obsessed Jew hater!
just for the record – Germans finally demolished it, that house built without permit
http://www.spiegel.de/international/zeitgeist/illegal-castle-built-by-beekeeper-torn-down-over-safety-concerns-a-837510.html
as to the translation Trutzburg means a castle that can withstand a siege. It didn’t in this case, maybe because neither HRW nor AI cared.
Haa those voices in your head again. Come home Daniel I don’t think you you are cut out for this settler thing . Acton calls.
dear me richard free speech and all that
la la la
the first comment ever from dear rich, that strikes me as being authentic, representing his identity to perfection
These are the kind of idiots we have to argue with.
Whatever happened to sane rational anti-Semitism.
Now who or what in that sketch resembles most the guy who calls himself rich?