Shabbat Shalom from the Neturei Karta's Rabbi Yisroel Dovid Weiss at PRC.
Ghada Karmi, an Exeter University lecturer, yesterday called for “the end of a Jewish state in our region” at the Palestinian Return Conference held at SOAS, London.
Israel claims that the PRC is affiliated with Hamas.
Karmi describes herself as Palestinian eventhough she has spent most of her life in Britain. The title of her talk was Ending the Naqba.
She said she regretted that so few people were at the conference (200 in an auditorium that holds about 450).
But instead of taking this as proof that people are not interested in giving up a Saturday to hear lies she insisted that until more people were engaged it would be difficult to change the situation for the Palestinians.
She blamed Israel’s crimes on the West: “The Zionist project would never have succeeded without Western complicity. Criminals might want to rob you, kill you, rape your daughters but normally they do not get away with it. Israel’s total impunity is so unusual today.”
She thought that a two state solution was impossible and was therefore disappointed that the Palestinian Authority is now calling for a Palestinian state to be recognised on the West Bank.
Instead she suggested going back to the roots of the conflict, which involved “dispossession and theft of a whole country. That a thief is allowed to get away with it and is still thieving and stealing is the basis of the conflict. The only way to reverse that is on the basis of rights and justice; that is the right of return of the refugees and the dispossessed and the exiles back to their homeland. If that were to happen we know very well that that would be the end of a Jewish state in our region.”
Karmi: “end of a Jewish state in our region” (at 20 mins 30 secs.)
This induced a rant (see clip below) from Rabbi Yisroel Dovid Weiss of the Neturei Karta. Farcically, Weiss refused to use the microphone as it was Shabbat although he was freely producing business cards from his satchel.
You can see Weiss telling Karmi not to confuse “Jewish” with “Zionist”. Karmi tried to wriggle out of it claiming that she had nothing against Jews or Judaism and that she had meant “Zionist state”, but that it was Israel’s fault for defining itself as “Jewish” in the first place.
Karmi: “I have nothing against Jews or Judaism” (at 4 mins.)
But Israel is a Jewish state!
After carefully trying to build an argument that the Palestinians had been wronged in 1948 it was finally clear that, for Karmi, the basis of the conflict is that there is “a Jewish state in our region”.
Dr. Salman Abu Sitta, who is the author of Atlas of Palestine, spoke on the Mechanisms of Expulsion.
He referred to the “original sin” as being the Balfour Declaration and constantly compared the Israelis to the Nazis. He described how during the 1948 War Palestinians were made to dig their own graves before being shot dead. Others were shoved into concentration camps, which were referred to as “POW camps”.
He referred to all kibbutzim as “semi-military structures” and claimed that the reason for Israel’s existence was not to accommodate people but to create “the largest military base in the world” and if only these bases were removed then the Palestinians could return to their old homes.
He said that the people of Gaza are just “throwing projectiles” into southern Israel as a message to the people there to get out of their old homes.
He concluded that in this age of the internet no one can say they didn’t know about the “racism and apartheid” practised by Israel and, therefore, silence is tantamount to complicity with these crimes.
This farce was played out in front of the Palestinian ambassador to the UK, Dr. Manuel Hassassian.
RichardMillett's Blog 
Yisroel Dovid Weiss – what a cunt.
Sigh … there is no such thing as a ‘Palestinian ambassador to the UK’.
Good post, Richard. I remember the first time I met you, you ‘had a word’ with some NK members then, too.
Chas and Angry, the NK are simply mad. You have to pity such people. They live in a completely detached bubble, unconnected with reality.
People like Ghada, on the other hand, can be prosecuted under the UK’s race hate laws. Or they could, if the CPS had the merest vestige of male gonads.
Phew! The theatre of the absurd indeed. The NK are certifiable loonies. Last year, walking around Meir Shearim in Jerusalem, I noticed they had posters all over the place bleating ‘Zionist collaborators out’. They don’t pay tax, hence the filthy streets, they don’t do military service and they don’t recognise Israel’s right to exist because God hasn’t given the go ahead yet I presume. So they canoodle with Hezbollah and attend the Holocaust denying conference in Teheran. The question I ask is whether THEY have a right to exist in Israel.
I saw that last year also, Roger. It was an incredible sight with all those mad posters up.
Without ‘Zionists’ the NK would be dead ducks. It seems that for them, if God wills a second Holocaust, then so be it.
Thanks for this, Richard.
I’d say Karmi is more like old school PLO, than Hamas. She enjoys the rights of women in a secular and liberal state, and I think she describes herself as a feminist. She and her family lived in a house in Golders Green, in Wycombe Gardens, near the Sainsburys, for about 40 years at least, I think. He was raised in a very Jewish of North London, and attended a girl’s school with a high proportion of Jewish pupils. She writes about it in her autobiography, In search of Fatima. I think Jewish support for Israel had a galvanizing effect on her. She rights about encountering PLO representatives in the 70s, and how they used to employ the euphemism ‘the revolution will come’, or something like that, when it came to discuss what would happen to the Jews when the PLO conquered. Now the PLO is prima facie prepared to accept a two state solution (while Netanyahu fiddles to Lieberman’s tune, to mix metaphors), and she remains truer to its original ‘vision’.
“Now the PLO is prima facie prepared to accept a two state solution”
Was that a squadron of interceptor pigs buzzing my house just now?
Yes, they are ‘prepared’ to accept it, provided Israel signs a suicide note first.
I think she still lives there and yesterday she said that it was a shame that more of the Jewish community weren’t like Weiss. Yea, right!
You mean, Good Knee-Bending Jews?
Richard
thank you
assuming that you have witnessed at least part of the above in person, I pronounce you material for a Medal of Honour
Even if you only managed to watch some of the stuff on live video you deserve to be awarded a price for bravery.
Richard,
In regard to your Karmi piece, I don’t know whether to thank you or chide you for ruining my Sunday morning before I even finished my first cup of coffee. I would have preferred to have kept my head in the sand for at least a little while. Well now that I’m revved up I’m off to join you in battle to fight the good fight. Am Yisroel Chai!
‘I think she still lives there’
Then it may be since 1948 or so. 60 years in one house.
My family had to move twice. Myself countless times. I lost my home in GG. I am now an ‘exile’, as I will never be able to afford to live in London (though nor would I want to).
Surely the original sin was World War I? If we hadn’t defeated the Turks and freed the Muslim Arabs, Jews, etc. (although overlooking many others, most notably the Kurds) there would have been no Balfour Declaration.
Is that said tongue in cheek?
just wanted to ask the same – original sin? it is always a nice question because one can go back and back and back
what if Napoleon had left Egypt alone
what if the Brits had let the Sudanese Mahdi have his way
what if the Americans had decided to get their fair share of the middle east after WW1 instead of letting the Brits and the French act to their hearts delight
what if Adam had refused to bite into Eva’s apple?
the original sin was in the garden of eden. arabs forget that if it wasn’t for the western powers they’d still be under turkish rule today.
I’ll buy that.
Poor turn out for so many speakers. Good.
On hearing the bearded creature predicting the end of Israel as a Jewish state, I was reminded:
“God is dead.”
-Nietzsche
“Nietzsche is dead.”
-God
Whatever myth rings your bell .
Who is without myth is to throw the first stone.
Me.
Hubris!
and be sure Poseidon is not one to tolerate such behaviour
You are misapplying the word ‘hubris’. I was stating a fact.
Yoni
that depends on how you define myth, by my definition not to believe in quite a lot is unachievable for sane humans.
Not sure what your problem is. I don’t believe, i.e. accept without further question, anything for which no verifiable form of empirical evidence is offered, i.e. a myth.
well that rules out lots and lots of “tested and proven” household remedies and homegrown everyday truths.
If they are ‘tested and proved’, then by definition there is verifiable empirical evidence.
“tested and proved” by grandma’s convictions ?
it may be verifiable but we still believe in lots that have not yet been verified and I’d assume that we still believe in lots that have been debunked but work because belief in grandma’s sayings has a strong placebo effect.
Not on me, it doesn’t. Grandma’s convictions on their own do not represent empirical evidence, as far as I am concerned.
Nor do I believe in things that have been debunked. That is not the way to sanity – it’s the way to being a trufer.
then I draw the conclusion that when you have a cold you don’t feel miserable
one year Piz Buin was declared the worst of the sun protection creams by the scientists at independent institute “test”, so I dutifully bought another brand for my vacation which got me a very unpleasant looking nose
coincidence maybe – proof no – but I continued to believe in Piz Buin.
German standard for diarrhea is porridge without milk and sugar and rusk
Greeks treated the affliction with especially grilled beafsteak (power to the weakened). Recovery? apparently the same for both but our German one is certified by university medical centers as indisputably the only one. Recently they have admitted that crackers and coke may not harm.
“I draw the conclusion that when you have a cold you don’t feel miserable”
I have no idea what you are talking about. That’s a complete non sequitur. Having a cold/feeling miserable has nothing to do with myths: it’s a state of the person’s psycho-physical system(s). Belief doesn’t come into it.
It’s entirely possible for both porridge and beef to be effective remedies for a given medical condition, acting in different ways (although I doubt that there are verified studies for the efficacy of beef in diarrhoea – it makes little sense). Moreover, diarrhoea is a symptom, not a condition: it can arise from a multitude of causes.
It is also entirely possible for a group of researchers at a given German medical centre to make a mistake, even to be complete idiots. Certainly, ‘certifying’ that something is ‘indisputably’ the only remedy would suggest the latter, although I am very skeptical about a serious research group having thus ‘certified’ anything.
Do you have any background in science?
Do you have any background in science?
thank heaven no, I argue exclusively from the standpoint of the victim of advice by scientists
but I almost always had the good luck to have colleagues who were scientists (chemists most of them) and their debunking of the always latest absolutely secure findings has saved me a lot of money.
I picked colds as an example because I have witnessed that people who feel miserable while having it are the ones (scientifically literate or not) who tend to put their trust in the weirdest of remedies.
“thank heaven no”
So basically you admit your complete ignorance of the subject you are ranting on and on about, indeed you are proud of your ignorance. Oh, dear. Oh, dear, oh, dear. And then you have the brass neck to accuse others of hubris.
“the always latest absolutely secure findings”
Clearly, you are also ignorant of the difference between scientists on the one hand, corporate technologists – and PR people – on the other.
No reputable scientist talks about “absolutely secure findings”, only corporate minions do.
thanks Yoni for upholstering my view that atheists are more similar to the pious than they feel able to admit to themselves.
if you claim that you only believe what is proved than that is hubris.
Hamlet or rather Shakespeare got it right
there are more things between heaven and earth … (my translation)
and no the argument that the “we research and explain everything” crowd just haven’t gone around to it yet is BS.
as to corporate minions – thank you very much – corporate minions are the ones who pay the taxes which finance a lot of their ivory towers lives.
It’s impossible to know where to even start with your smug, patronising, rude, ignorant, comprehensive and unmitigated nonsense.
For a start, you suffer from a very serious reading comprehension issue:
“if you claim that you only believe what is proved”
I never said anything of the sort. I was talking about empirical evidence, not about ‘proof’. Get your remedial teacher to explain to you the difference between the two.
Then we have the strawman, the last resort of the arrogant ignoramus who has been found out, has run out of arguments but won’t admit it:
“the argument that the “we research and explain everything” crowd just haven’t gone around to it yet is BS”
So speaks an ignoramus who is proud to know nothing about science and yet thinks she can spout ‘wisdom’ about science.
No serious scientist claims that “we’ll explain everything (given time)”. Only an arrogant ignoramus like you would claim that they do.
Clearly, you have no idea what I meant by ‘corporate minions’, but again your arrogance won’t allow you to admit it. These are the dishonest advertisers your gullibility led you to believe, like a small child buying sweets from a crook, so the ‘wonder product’ let you down. Instead of blaming your own gullibility, you throw a tantrum and blame ‘scientists’. Utterly laughable.
because I like people to be happy I concede defeat and oh so humbly apologize for my mixed up vocabulary
as I usually do, when people start getting slippery:
You called my colleagues “corporate minions” and though some of them were nuts a lot were decent knowledgeable und humble fellows – humble in the sense of I know that I know nothing and that was independent of whether they admired high-brow talk about Flying Spaghetti Monsters or adhered to established whatevers.
… and continue to enjoy my life “In Broken Images”
He is quick, thinking in clear images;
I am slow, thinking in broken images.
http://www.xs4all.nl/~ace/Literaria/Poem-Graves.html
Have a good time, if I hadn’t learned differently I’d by now be convinced that you are very young
.
And someone like you, who is convinced that everyone who thinks differently suffers from ‘hubris’, is very old and wise, eh?
Smug idiot.
Did I really have to be in the background of this ranting rabbi video clip.
Kol Hakavod though on the blog. Ishar Koach Achi!
btw – i counted 50 +/-, then a bus load of 20+/- and little future suicide bombers, not including security & journalists of course.