Shlomo Sand: “Zionism created the Palestinian People.”

There’s been much controversy over Newt Gingrich’s recent comment that the Palestinians are an invented people.

Perish the thought. The Palestinians have ruled in a county called “Palestine” for at least two millennia (a heavy dose of irony here, obviously). In contrast Zionism is a relatively new concept; the first Zionist congress having take place a mere 114 years ago.

It’s lucky that Gingrich’s outrageous comment has been dealt with in such reasonable terms by the Palestinian leadership with Saeb Erekat saying:

“Mark my words…these statements of Gingrich’s will be ammunitions and weapons of the bin Ladens and the extremists for a long, long time.”

Erekat was also referring to Gingrich’s statement that Palestinians are terrorists who “teach terrorism in their schools”. However, Palestinian children are not brainwashed to want to kill Israelis despite Palestinian Media Watch’s many clips  showing them wanting to become “martyrs”.

On the Palestinians being an invented people this is a fairly standard discussion for any nation. Why should the Palestinians be exempt?

Meanwhile, on the accusation of terrorism bin Laden would have been delighted to think, if it were true, that the Palestinians and their children are following in his esteemed footsteps.

But if it is so insulting to suggest that the Palestinians are an invented people how more insulting is it to say that they were invented by Zionism?

Who would make such an outrageous remark?

Golda Meir? She said there is no such thing as a Palestinian.

Newt Gingrich again? He said the Palestinians were invented, but at least he didn’t have the gall to suggest by Zionism.

Actually, the person who said this was Shlomo Sand, hero of the Palestinians, anti-Zionists and anti-Semites everywhere, when he spoke at SOAS earlier this year about his book The Invention of the Jewish People.

Let him tell you in his own words:

43 responses to “Shlomo Sand: “Zionism created the Palestinian People.”

  1. Newt Gingrich has done more in one statement to out replacement propaganda than all the oped writers have a achieved in 10 years. He has reminded those of us who know history of the facts and hopefully helped the propaganda gullibles to reconsider their perceived knowledge.

    “……..Former Romanian intelligence officer Ion Pacepa claimed outright that in 1964:
    The PLO was dreamt up by the KGB,
    which had a penchant for “liberation”
    organizations. There was the National
    Liberation Army of Bolivia, created
    by the KGB in 1964 with help from
    Ernesto “Che” Guevara. Then there
    was the National Liberation Army
    of Colombia, created by the KGB in
    1965 with help from Fidel Castro,
    which was soon deeply involved in
    kidnappings, hijackings, bombings
    and guerrilla warfare. In later years
    the KGB also created the Democratic
    Front for the Liberation of Palestine,
    which carried out numerous bombing
    attacks on the “Palestinian territories”
    occupied by Israel, and the
    “Secret Army for Liberation of Armenia,”
    created by the KGB in 1975,
    which organized numerous bombing
    attacks against US airline offices in
    Western Europe….”
    read more….

  2. Richard – from where do you get the information that supports your statement “The Palestinians have ruled in a country called Palestine for at least two millenia”? There was no currency, there was no monarch or leader -how can any country “rule” without a leader?. etc etc

    The truth is that these disparate peoples were in fact a “hetrogeneous” communitty with no “Palestinian” identiy and according to an official British historical analysis in 1920 no Arab identity either. “The people west of the Jordan are not Arabs but only Arabic speaking. The bulk of the population are fellahin….. In the Gaza district they are mostly of Egyptian origin;elsewhere they are of the most mixed race”.

    • richardmillett

      No, I was being heavily ironic, but obviously failing.

      • Richard – I got the irony. The only problem with irony is that when people don’t get it the message as read is spread! That is when you will be quoted out of context just like the man accused of stealing the chicken!

      • richardmillett

        What’s the chicken story?

      • When asked by the judge if he killed the chicken, he shrugged his shoulders tilted his head and asked in Yiddish “I killed the chicken?” emphasis on the “I”, the intonation being one of incredulity that anybody should think he could do such a thing. The interpreter interpreted acurately “Your Honour he said he killed the chicken.” Guilty as acused!

      • Wouldn’t that be sarcasm? As opposed to irony? Other than that, great post.

  3. “I stole a chicken??” Yes, Sharon flags up the danger. I also got the heavy irony, but best put up some kind of irony alert icon. Otherwise you can end up with unstoppable myths like this one, where no amount of subsequent public disclaimer by the real author of the letter could reverse.

    Never mind Carter, even Geoffrey Alderman quoted this as fact years after it was exposed, and when I wrote to him to advise him to put a correction in his next column, he huffily declined.

    That said, this Sands clip is brilliant journalism and should be republished far and wide as rejoinder to the the faux indignation triggered by Gingrich’s comment. Did you hear the whole Gingrich clip where even the miserable isolationist Rick Perry grudgingly concedes Newt is right on this point.

  4. Richard: A man reacts to the accusation that he stole a chicken in the wounded tones characteristic of Yiddish inflections by saying “I stole a chicken??!” Meaning “Who, me? Are you crazy! “But ignoring the ironic inflection, it is taken as a straight confession.

  5. I send you this-
    “An interesting questionnaire  for Palestinian’s Advocates
    By Yashiko Sagamori
    If you are so sure that ” Palestine, the country, goes back through most of recorded history,” I expect you to be able to answer a few basic questions about that country of Palestine:  

    1.  When was it founded and by whom?
      2.  What were its borders?
     3.  What was its capital?
      4.  What were its major cities?
      5.  What constituted the basis of its economy?
      6.  What was its form of government?
      7.  Can you name at least one Palestinian leader before Arafat?

      8.  Was Palestine ever recognized by a country whose existence, at that time or now, leaves no room for interpretation?
    9.  What was the language of the country of Palestine ?
      10. What was the prevalent religion of the country of Palestine ?
    11. What was the name of its currency? Can you produce a “Palestinian” coin? Choose any date in history and tell what was the approximate exchange rate of the Palestinian monetary unit against the US dollar, German mark, GB pound, Japanese yen, Israeli shekel, or Chinese yuan on that date.
    12. And, finally, since there is no such country today, what caused its demise and when did it occur?
    You are lamenting the “low sinking” of a “once proud” nation. Please tell me, when exactly was that “nation” proud and what was it so proud of?
    And what were its achievements?
    And here is the least question: If the people you call “Palestinians” are anything but generic Arabs collected from all over — or thrown out of — the Arab world, if they really have a genuine ethnic identity that gives them a right for self-determination, why did they never try to become independent until Arabs suffered their devastating defeat in the Six Day War before which Egypt OCCUPIED Gaza and Jordan OCCUPIED the West Bank?
     I hope you will avoid the temptation to trace the modern day “Palestinians” to the Biblical Philistines, Greek sailors: substituting etymology for history won’t work here.
    The truth should be obvious to everyone who wants to know it. Arab countries have never abandoned the dream of destroying Israel ; they still cherish it today. Having time and again failed to achieve their evil goal with military means, they decided to fight Israel by proxy, revisions of history and propaganda. For that purpose, they created a terrorist organization, cynically called it “the Palestinian people” and installed it in Gaza, and Judea and Samaria that the media calls The West Bank. How else can you explain the refusal by Jordan and Egypt to unconditionally accept back the “West Bank” and Gaza, respectively?
    The fact is, Arabs populating Gaza, Judea and Samaria have much less claim to nationhood than that Indian tribe that successfully emerged in Connecticut with the purpose of starting a tax-exempt casino: at least that tribe had a constructive goal that motivated them.

    and allow Yashiko Sagamori to speak for me.

    • richardmillett

      I’m being ironic, steve!
      Sent from my BlackBerry® wireless device

      • I realise that- But these questions should be “Thrown” every time its mentioned –
        In fact I have just come off of the Guardians comment page where some female columnist was having a go at Newt Gingrich over his Palestine remarks-
        I pasted all those questions into the discussion- Bingo- The whole topic was removed!

      • richardmillett

        Bloody hell, you’re kidding! They took everything off? This is one for cifwatch.

      • So the Guardian cannot publish the truth. I don’t read it for that reason, but this removal clarifies catagorically why Guardian readers are ignorant. Maybe you should post more about Gingich’s statement. He has created a watershed re so called Palestine and finally this hypocrytical rag will have to publish the truth or go the way of the NoW.

  6. It is the manifestation of an incredible mediocrity that today some here still want to discuss whether or not the Palestinians are a ‘Real People’. As if this has (or should have) any bearing on anyone’s universal rights. But I guess in the racist ‘Blood and Soil’ minds of ultra-zionists, if somehow (and by their self-serving criteria) you can declare such-or-such a people aren’t a ‘Real People’ you can grab their land without much further ado, as if being a Polish (or insert whatever nationality) Jew somehow gives you that right.

    It’s rather ironic that this [Gingrich] comment should come from an American, of all peoples definitely an ‘invented’ one, and one that committed ethnic cleansing and genocide on a rather massive scale to make room for ‘Americans’. I don’t see anyone disputing the right of Americans to a state (and neither do I).

    Gingrich and the rest of the crop of Republican presidential wannabes seem to have decided to try and outdo each other in terms of outlandishness. But I doubt if pandering to an anti-abortion, anti-environment, anti-tax, anti-evolution, anti-government, “yo, we done need no book learnin’” Evangelical base will land them the big prize.

    Perhaps when Zionism has colonised nearly all of the West Bank and it will have little choice but to annex that territory to pander to the settler movement, it will want to refuse equal rights to the ‘Palestinian Untermenschen’ on the basis that they’re not a ‘Real People? I’d like to see how the world reacts to that…

    • @ Gert – are you really such a dick head? The discussion is not about whether or not the Palestinians are a real people, but who they are as a nation, if they are one at all, and where they came from. They say they are the original people of ancient Israel thus replacing the Jews as a nation, denying me of my birthright and you are concerned about them being outed as frauds!! The entire discourse embraced by stupid idiots like you digests the propaganda created by the KGB in the 1960’s when THEY created the PLO to act as their proxy in the Middle East with a manifesto that then sprouted Marxist theory. What the stupid Russians did not bank on was the Islamic propagandists being such good pupils that they would replace Marxist theory with their own existential Islamic propaganda. And the Russians didn’t bank on ignoramuses like you swallowing Islamic replacement theory hook line and sinker to the extent that you no longer have a mind of your own.

      Well you can bow down to Allah if you want like the students at Royal Holloway College did this Christmas at their carol service – yes carol service with Jesus the son of Allah!!! I for one never will and I support Gingrich as the only grown up around able to bring the world back to its senses. After all he is protecting his Christian birthright with Jesus son of Mary and Joseph, Jews as they were and not Muslims.

      This was never about Jews and Israel and all about the spread of Islam across the globe. Perhaps when Islam has colonised nearly all of the West and it will have little choice but to annex that territory to pander to the liberal secular movement, it will want to refuse equal rights to the ‘Western Untermenschen’ on the basis that they’re not a ‘Real People? I’d like to see how you react[s] to that…if of course you are not found gang-chained in the basement of a madrassa in Pakistan being force fed Islam terrorist dogma!
      Don’t miss the video for a sample of what you might experience during your “enlightenment”

      • I’d like to see how the world reacts to that…

        Ah finally Bridlington’s greatest pundit tells us his dearest wish.

      • @ Silke
        You will wait awful long time. I hope you are patient!

      • Sharon
        I am not the one who intends to wait.

        I was referring to Gert’s telling us that he looks forward to seeing what he envisages as the something.

    • What a dickhead Gert is. The whole point of the mythical ‘Palestinian nation’ is that they want to grab the mythical ‘country of Palestine’, in fact the historic country of Israel, and kill its Jewish inhabitants. I bet even the thought of that gives Gert a woody.

  7. Never thought I’d agree with Thomas Friedman but there’s a first for everything and on these snippets I find it hard to disagree:

    ”That thought came to mind last week when Newt Gingrich took the Republican competition to grovel for Jewish votes — by outloving Israel — to a new low by suggesting that the Palestinians are an “invented” people and not a real nation entitled to a state.
    This was supposed to show that Newt loves Israel more than Mitt Romney, who only told the Israeli newspaper Israel Hayom that he would move the U.S. embassy from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem because “I don’t seek to take actions independent of what our allies think is best, and if Israel’s leaders thought that a move of that nature would be helpful to their efforts, then that’s something I’ll be inclined to do. … I don’t think America should play the role of the leader of the peace process. Instead, we should stand by our ally.”
    That’s right. America’s role is to just applaud whatever Israel does, serve as its A.T.M. and shut up. We have no interests of our own. And this guy’s running for president?
    As for Newt, well, let’s see: If the 2.5 million West Bank Palestinians are not a real people entitled to their own state, that must mean Israel is entitled to permanently occupy the West Bank and that must mean — as far as Newt is concerned — that Israel’s choices are: 1) to permanently deprive the West Bank Palestinians of Israeli citizenship and put Israel on the road to apartheid; 2) to evict the West Bank Palestinians through ethnic cleansing and put Israel on the road to the International Criminal Court in the Hague; or 3) to treat the Palestinians in the West Bank as citizens, just like Israeli Arabs, and lay the foundation for Israel to become a binational state. And this is called being “pro-Israel”?
    I sure hope that Israel’s prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, understands that the standing ovation he got in Congress this year was not for his politics. That ovation was bought and paid for by the Israel lobby. The real test is what would happen if Bibi tried to speak at, let’s say, the University of Wisconsin. My guess is that many students would boycott him and many Jewish students would stay away, not because they are hostile but because they are confused.
    It confuses them to read that Israel’s foreign minister, Avigdor Lieberman, who met with Prime Minister Vladimir Putin of Russia last Wednesday, was quoted as saying that the recent Russian elections were “absolutely fair, free and democratic.” Yes, those elections — the ones that brought thousands of Russian democrats into the streets to protest the fraud. Israel’s foreign minister sided with Putin.
    It confuses them to read that right-wing Jewish settlers attacked an Israeli army base on Tuesday in the West Bank, stoning Israeli soldiers in retaliation for the army removing “illegal” settlements that Jewish extremists establish wherever they want.
    It confuses them to read, as the New Israel Fund reports on its Web site, that “more than 10 years ago, the ultra-Orthodox community asked Israel’s public bus company, Egged, to provide segregated buses in their neighborhoods. By early 2009, more than 55 such lines were operating around Israel. Typically, women are required to enter through the bus back doors and sit in the back of the bus, as well as ‘dress modestly.’ ”
    It confuses them to read a Financial Times article from Israel on Monday, that said: “In recent weeks, the country has been consumed by an anguished debate over a series of new laws and proposals that many fear are designed to stifle dissent, weaken minority rights, restrict freedom of speech and emasculate the judiciary. They include a law that in effect allows Israeli communities to exclude Arab families; another that imposes penalties on Israelis advocating a boycott of products made in West Bank Jewish settlements; and proposals that would subject the supreme court to greater political oversight.”
    And it confuses them to read Gideon Levy, a powerful liberal voice, writing in Haaretz, the Israeli daily, this week that “anyone who says this is a matter of a few inconsequential laws is leading others astray. … What we are witnessing is w-a-r. This fall a culture war, no less, broke out in Israel, and it is being waged on many more, and deeper, fronts than are apparent. It is not only the government, as important as that is, that hangs in the balance, but also the very character of the state.”
    So while Newt is cynically asking who are the Palestinians, he doesn’t even know that more than a few Israelis are asking, “Who are we?”

    Go on, tell me he’s a self-loathing Jewish traitor: you know you want to!

    • @ Gert – Friedman is a stupid idiot just like you.

      What politician can rely on a lobby the size of a thumbnail to get elected! There are today more Muslims in the US than Jews which is why we are seeing a President happy with erecting a Mosque at ground zero where adherents of that ideology killed 3000 of its citizens, why the President bows and kowtows to Sheikhs and Islamic despots, why the President asks politely for his drone to be returned from Iran, still waiting on a response. I guess his beard will be as long as Methuselah’s before he gets that response, or perhaps his head will have been blown off by one of the nukes Iran doesn’t have long before then. Either way the response will be long coming.

      Friedman – your new found friend – writes of Israel possibly ethnically cleansing the West Bank of Arabs, but no mention of Abbas stating that Jews will never be able to live in a future [2nd] Palestinian state – thus ethnically cleansing Jews from the West bank. Explain why one way traffic westward is acceptable but not Eastward. Also explain why Friedman – and it seems you – leave the already created Palestinian state out of the equation. Jordan already exists and is The Palestinian state only for some reason none of you dick heads will bother to read some history for yourselves – far easier to simply swallow the rubbish dished out to you by Islamic propagandists.

      Well if you want to wear a long beard and pray to Mecca whilst your women are draped in robes to hide their faces lest they remind men of their womanhood and then raped at will according to decree, so be it. I will not live that way and thank God for Gingrich as he will make sure it never happens to we women in the West! Israel is really the red herring you and your fellow fool travel-mates have fallen for – it is you they are after and they will get you they think through us, the Jews. Thankfully we are cleverer than the lot of you put together – remember we have existed as a nation for longer than your history can recount and we will remain here longer than you can ever imagine, bringing real peace and goodwill to all men [and women of course] once we have dealt with the liberation movement created to destroy us!

  8. Yes its so- re the Guardian- I can not recall the Journalists name- But the headline was “Should God forgive Newt Gingrich” Re his Palestinian remarks-

    I have even gone into their search box- Just comes up with zero hits.

  9. “”…That thought came to mind last week when Newt Gingrich took the Republican competition to grovel for Jewish votes…”

    This is nonsense. US Jews have never voted Republican and their support for Republican candidates has never even reached 25%. Furthermore, we are still at the primary elections stage and it is unlikely that even these few are all registered Republicans.

    Furthermore, as in the UK, most American Jews do not vote according to which candidate is perceived as being the most pro-Israel. They have their own agendas; social, economic, etc.

    Finally, with the exception of the Orthodox community, I imagine that most US Jews have views regarding the Arab-Israeli conflict far to the Left of Gingrich, actually not that far from those of Gert and Richard – “Two-State Solution” and so on.

    If we are to assume that Gingrich does not really believe in what he says, an assumption I have no reason to make, then his statements are an attempt to “grovel” for Christian not Jewish votes, specifically Evangelical votes. A cynic might say that he knows that his history of three wives and two mistresses poses problems for the family values image of social conservatives and so hopes to woo the voters with his radically pro-Israel stand.

    Either way, if I was an American he’d have my vote. Fatties of the world unite!

    • richardmillett

      I love the way you set the cat amongst the pigeons with your “not that far from those of Gert and Richard”. You sure know how to offend Gert!
      Sent from my BlackBerry® wireless device

  10. I was hoping to flatter you, actually.

    • and I arrived here in full gallopp eager to save Richard from the evil company you put him in only to learn that Brits have a sense of humour no dumb European can ever hope to anticipate.

  11. Interestingly, as debate rages on this superb blog a similar discussion is taking place on the very excellent:

    On that highly popular blog all the regular contributors, specifically Gert and myself, are analyzing a fascinating recording of the Newt Gingrich interview. We both warmly welcome guests.

    • Oh how I’d love to ask Gert if he’d have called Stalin a scumbag also when his chosen homeland was only too happy to get support from that one.

      How picky they were then and how wise.

      But alas Gert has vowed to never let me in on his precious blog, so all I can do tell you here what I would have said there.

      • Hi Silke,

        I think I can get you in, now that Gert and I are bests buddies, but you must refrain from mentioning 5,000 murdered Syrians or approximately 100,000 dead Iraqis. We only discuss Zionist atrocities there and when there aren’t any, we copy and paste nasty articles about Israel from various sources.

        Oh and don’t mention any Belgian mass murderers either. They’re off-topic.

        We could do with some female company there, or male, or anyone. There used to be another bloke called Manny too, but he seems to have become thoroughly bored and gone. How strange!?

      • Dear Daniel,

        after I had written this I was about to sign in but then I saw that it would give Gert access to an e-mail address of mine and that quite frankly is closer to him than I care to get. Thus I decided to stick with my self-imposed rule to give direct contact information only to people I consider to be trustworthy. But of course I’ll continue to wait with breathless attention for the next round, now that Gert has already mastered his first insult.

        Maybe I live-blog about it on here? How’s that for a compromise?

        Now let’s see whether Daniel’s invitation will help me overcome the barrier and make me able to ask that question about scumbag support I’d like to ask so much.

        And already I am trembling with feat, without the blog author approving my contribution it will vanish forever. Maybe I better copy and paste just in case the blog author (author???) sticks to his promise to never ever let me in.

    • Daniel
      I had a look at that blog. What rubbish to waste your time on. This Gert is more of a dick head than I thought!

      • He’s also on Greensteins blog spewing the same excrement .
        Why let him post here Richard ? There’s nothing to engage with .Just boot him .

      • Dickhead indeed: he is accusing Gingrich of being “gregarious”.

        And then there is that as-a-Jew idiot Amira Hass (well named), a swivel-eyed loon going off on one about ‘Israeli dictatorship over the heroic Palestinians’.

  12. Friedman is a Theobold Jew, the worst kind. Only Jonathan Hoffman, by following the actions of his sainted mentor, HaRav HaGadol Meir Kahane, Zt”L, Hy”D, know how to deal with these treacherous self-haters

  13. Of course, both of you are exaggerating; he was neither a saint nor a thug. Rabbi Kahana was an intelligent and extremely articulate Jew who had radical views, many of which were in my opinion quite wrong.

    Incidentally, it’s amusing to read two invented characters arguing.

  14. Have you not seen a specialist yet about your delusions, Daniel? I would recommend it urgently. They can be treated, you know.

    As for not being a thug: nonsense. I have seen him egging on his sidekicks to assault peaceful people present at his demagogic meetings.

  15. What has being intelligent and articulate got to do with not being a racist and/or a thug? Goebbels was articulate and highly intelligent. You really aren’t the sharpest in the box, are you?