Pre-Christmas numbers down outside Ahava

Where have all the anti-Ahava protesters gone?

Not that I’m complaining but a mere 10 turned up today, which is a bit pathetic considering “Palestine is the moral issue of our time”.

It is “the moral issue of our time” until the pro-Palestinian protesters have better things to do like Christmas shopping or maybe it is the cold.

They used to number about 40-50 but the numbers have dramatically dropped off in recent times.

That isn’t to say that the cowardly protesters aren’t still trying to intimidate the all female staff that work in the shop.

There was yet another early morning paint attack on the shop front which means that the last year has been quite violent with repeated invasions by protesters, doorlocks glued up and repeated paint attacks.

Roll on 2011 and hopefully a few convictions to prove that we are not going to become a society where the rule of law is subservient to the whims of those who have an ideological hatred towards the Jewish state.

In 2010 there were no convictions and two acquittals as lawyers for anti-Israel activists on trial ran rings round the Crown Prosecution Service, with one dodgy anti-Israel judge thrown in for good measure.

Back to today and I had a very nice chat with one anti-Israel activist who was new to the protest.

We stood side-by-side handing out leaflets and she kept badgering me about who I was, what music I liked and she suggested a joint venture where we could hand out each other’s leaflets.

I tried to ignore her but she was persistent, so I asked her what other causes she got involved in.

She was against the student cuts and the Iraq war and is a feminist although when I asked what she was doing for the women who were being stoned to death in Iran she said that there was nothing she could do and asked me what I was doing about it instead.

To give her credit she was the first anti-Israel activist I have met who unequivocally denounced Hamas.

I couldn’t help noticing that many of the anti-Israel activists had taken to wearing, in addition to Santa hats, anti-Ahava signs around their necks, which, sadly, brings to mind the image of Jews being forced to wear signs around their necks by the Nazis.

Jewish lawyer carrying self-Insulting sign "I will not complain to the police again." (isurvived.org)

Jewish lawyer carrying self-Insulting sign "I will not complain to the police again." (isurvived.org)

On a more uplifting note Ahava seemed to be doing a decent pre-Christmas trade.

If anything, the protests and attacks on the shop have brought it publicity.

Those who never knew about the shop now go there or online to buy its skin-healing products and those who hate Israel wouldn’t shop there anyway.

Meanwhile, I continue to salute the indefatigability of the small group of loyal Ahava staff who turn up day-in day-out not knowing what they will find or who could menacingly burst in without warning.

156 responses to “Pre-Christmas numbers down outside Ahava

  1. “those who have an ideological hatred towards the Jewish state”

    That’s one way of wording it …
    .

  2. I’m just into trying to train myself to understand what “Pinkwashing” is all about. The image of that paint on that window might help me to remember it next time when I read the explanation for it.

  3. oops forgot to subscribe

  4. Thanks Richard. Indeed, I didn’t know of Ahava until these antisemitic demonstrations – since when, I have repeatedly made online orders. to help support Ahava.

    Thanks, hateful morons (the clowns seen above)!

    • I also didn’t knew about those ‘protesters’ until recently. Thanks to them
      i find a place to do my Christmas shoping. Thanks to them everyone now gets 3 presents instead of one. From now on all my body care stuff will be bought at this shop (and as much other Israeli production as possible).
      Now, what’s next shop you ‘protesters’ gonna attack? I will save me lots of time. Thanks by the way, pricks.

      • Well said, Eugene.
        As soon as the antisemitic pricks started boycotting Israeli goods, the percentage of Israeli fruit & veg in my shopping went up from ca. 15% to ca. 75%.

  5. Well done Richard for spending yet another Saturday standing up to this hatred.

  6. Richard,

    I think that like many things political movements have a kind of a life-cycle. First they’re young and learning, then they’re sexy youths attracting others and rebelling against older movements. After that they reach a kind of middle age, putting on weight, arousing less enthusiasm, still repeating the same slogans but their eyes no longer light up as they did and they’re is less conviction in their voices.

    Could it be that the anti-Ahava struggle has reached its mid-life crises? The anti-Semites/Zionist can see that the shop is still there and their wives need them to tidy out the garage this Saturday afternoon. They’ve been chanting about mud and blood for months now, but nothing much seems to have changed.

    It’s very cold outside, there’s something good on telly and the friend who they thought they’d go to the demo with is making excuses. The chanting lady in the black tights aren’t doing it for them anymore….. And it’s very cold outside.

    Could it be?

  7. Richard,

    A Sudden Crazy Thought

    “…she suggested a joint venture where we could hand out each other’s leaflets.”

    Assuming the lady in question had no romantic intentions, could it be that this was her way of offering a kind of truce?

    Why not bring as many people as you can next time and then offer a truce of your own? If they do not demonstrate, neither will you. It sounds crazy, but maybe they need a way to climb down from their tree and they’ll conclude that to cancel a small anti-Ahava demo for large pro-Ahava one isn’t a bad deal.

    They’ll probably turn you down, but then you’ll have whoever supported the offer well pissed off that he still has to shlep along every fortnight because they wouldn’t accept it. Divide and rule!!

    What do you have to lose?

  8. “On a more uplifting note Ahava seemed to be doing a decent pre-Christmas trade.”

    Indeed. I’m doing lots of Xmas shopping from them, and asking friends to get me presents from there, too. I look forward to much Ahava pampering over the festive season and beyond!

    A reminder that one can order from there via the web, too. Their delivery times and packaging etc are excellent.

    “Assuming the lady in question had no romantic intentions…”

    I bet she did, the minx.

  9. I forgot the link for mail order: http://www.ahava.co.uk/

  10. Well.. it is a bit chilly out…

    The BDS brigade have now moved on to their winter pastures again – inside nice warm supermarkets. Take a look at these Princeton students – a ‘Lesbian BDS group’ no less; boycotting Sabra Hummus – the ‘Israeli’ Hummus that isn’t really.

    WARNING: Extremely wince-making and cringeworthy – but don’t worry. It is them – it’s not you.

  11. I see that DM is yet again suggesting that maybe they are only ‘anti-Zionists’, maybe not really antisemites at all. Some people never learn, do they? It’s a shame that it’s not only they who have to repeat history as a result of not learning from it, but also others.

  12. You make an assumption based on nothing:
    “..t DM is yet again suggesting that maybe they are only ‘anti-Zionists’, maybe not really antisemites at all.”

    reach a conclusion that was not mine then screw up the world’s best known cliche in order to refute it:

    “…they who have to repeat history as a result of not learning from it.”

    I have gone down or the record numerous times, including on this blog, as having stated my belief that the demonstrators in question are anti-Semites. I have met pro-Ahava demonstrators and given some advice at their request. Without giving too much away, the main point I made initially was to focus on the similarity between he anti-Ahava (neutral term) and the Nazi movement. All this is a matter of public knowledge and Richard or Ruth will confirm it.

    However, I recognize Richard’s sensitivity regarding the use of the word anti-Semite, which he apparently thinks could cause legal problems or something of the like. For the same reason he is oft to edit it out of various postings.

    With an eye to avoiding him such complications I used the anti-Zionist/Semite term. Again, I don’t believe that I’ve revealed any secrets here and if I have Richard is welcome to delete this posting.

    Now an idea. Stop reading through every posting in an infantile way looking for a word or phrase that you can nit-pick about. Read the whole posting, decide whether you agree or not, then state your opinion about the matter in hand. Or in other words, grow up.

  13. They look soooooo… cute in their Santa hats. The irony is that not one of them probably celebrates Christmas.

  14. DM: “The anti-Semites/Zionist can see that the shop is still there”
    Y: “I see that DM is yet again suggesting that maybe they are only ‘anti-Zionists’”
    DM: “You make an assumption based on nothing”

    When have you last had your eyes tested, DM?

    “screw up the world’s best known cliche ”

    That is not a ‘cliche’. You need to buy a better dictionary. At most, it’s a truism. And I didn’t ‘screw it up’: I paraphrased it since to quote it verbatim for the millionth time might be a bit boring. And I assumed that the reader would recognise it in paraphrase. I was proven right, although you evidently have trouble understanding what it means.

    DM: “Stop reading through every posting in an infantile way looking for a word or phrase that you can nit-pick about.”
    DM: “screw up the world’s best known cliche”

    Hypocritical idiot.

    DM: “I trod on some dreck” [meaning me].
    DM: “grow up”.

    Tosser.
    .

  15. Jesus, Mary and Joseph were Jews. Bethlehem was a Jewish town, which is now OCCUPIED by Arabs. I guess these clueless hateful morons can’t grapple with that.

  16. In case it is true that Brits love to encounter under the mistle toe for a bit of kissing during Christmas time I feel a bit of pity for the outer appearance of some of the protesters especially the looks of that guy who is Bruce? makes me expect all kinds of rebukes for him. So here’s my bit of advice:

    If the mating season looms
    and you seem condemned to dooms
    don’t despair und start to hope
    not from surgeon or from pope
    if photoshop won’t do the trick
    neither facelift nor a wig,
    round the corner winks salvation
    with AHAVA as pure elation.
    Once applied and well rubbed in
    from the nose down to the shin
    makes you shine and promisses
    life with heaps and heaps of kissesses

  17. I ask Richard to adjudicate this matter:

    Yoni,

    You are a liar and invent statements that I’ve never made as you find it easier to argue with your own idiocy than with what I write.

    When you accredited me with saying implying anti-Ahava activists are not antisemitic I ignored you. When you imagined that I had said that the Israeli Left wish to give back all of Israel (obviously included areas not under dispute) I ignored it. However, now you have gone too far.

    I have never used the word drek on this or any other blog and if I had, I would not have misspelled it like an ignoramus. When you twisted my words, I put it down to your limited ability to understand written texts. Though I have said that you remind me of dog droppings etc, that sentence was a complete fabrication.

    When you take words that I have never said and put them in inverted commas, that is a deliberate lie and falsification. Show me the posting where I wrote:

    “I trod on some dreck”

    I will publicly apologize (on this blog). If you can’t you are either a liar, a total idiot incapable of cutting and pasting, or both. Which is it?

    Well done you’ve managed to ruin another excellent blog page and drag it down literally to the level of the gutter.

  18. Ahava comes from an illegal settlement in the occupied West Bank (where the Palestinians are still after 43 years held as stateless non-citizens under Israeli martial law), it violates the fourth Geneva convention to sell goods obtained in this way. Nearly all jurists inside and outside of Israel believe the Convention is the appropriate legal framework regarding the occupation.

    Even if you disagree with the strategy of boycott as a means to secure a peaceful and just solution to the… ‘situation’, surely anyone with moral character should refuse settlement produce on basic principle?

  19. I was under the impression that

    “drek” is the Yiddish spelling
    and
    “Dreck” is the German spelling (note the capital D which all our substantives have)

    Google says both versions come from the same root but I didn’t check whether there is an alternative Yiddish spelling “dreck”. Do both words after such a long time have these days still the same meaning and/or are used for the same purpose?

    I don’t remember having come across “Dreck” on a German blog and anyway I go there too seldom to know whether it is in fashion there but I’d bet rather not i.e. I think I would prefer “Schmutz” or “Müll” for the purpose while using “Dreck” for the stuff I have to cope with when I remember that it is time to suffer the noise of the vacuum cleaner.

  20. It’s such a great blog. It deserves better than the tiresome, circular point-scoring that seems to erupt in the comments.

    Get a room already.

  21. Wow, I misspelled a Yiddish word, so now I am an ‘ignoramus’ – ROFLMAOWMP.
    What about your various incorrect punctuations, DM, or the “use construct” sentence: does that make you an ignoramus also?
    You are a typical sandbox bully: you can dish it out, but not take it.
    You have been caught lying and misquoting me by way of omission several times, DM. Don’t go down the route of accusing me of lying, little man, because you are the liar.
    And you most certainly have compared me to droppings you’d trod in, little liar.

  22. “When you accredited me with saying implying anti-Ahava activists are not antisemitic I ignored you. ”

    I wonder what language our resident non-ignorant genius imagines the above is written in. It’s not English, that’s for sure.
    It is, moreover, a blatant lie. I never suggested or “said implied” anything of the sort. I said that according to you, perhaps (look up this word in your Ladybird Primary Reader stage III) they may not be antisemites but only anti-Zionists – which is what you posted. What is it with you and your reading comprehension issues? Having trouble progressing to Ladybird Primary Reader stage IV, are you? Alternatively, of course, you are simply a liar.

  23. Dear Richard,

    I have only once contributed to your wonderful site. I lived all my life in English speaking countries and made aliyah only a few years and still feel that I’m learning the ropes, if you know what I mean. I enjoy your essays very much and the lively debate that often follows them. Silke is always wonderful. Your pictures of London sometimes make me a little homesick as I spent several years there when I was a young girl.

    I would just like to request that you control your writers a little bit more. This was a very interesting theme and I was quite upset when Yoni once again turned it into a place to vent his frustrations. I have children and grandchildren and know how excited they can get, so maybe it is your responsibility to calm him down when need be and remind him of the theme of your essay. I’m sure he means well, and it seems that he sometimes doesn’t understand other writers’ comments. Perhaps because he is an Israeli – their English can sometimes be atrocious.
    I wish you all the best of luck both on the site and at your demonstrations. You are doing a real mitzvah.

    Sincerely,
    K. Olsson

    • Kathy
      I appreciate your compliment but I do not want to be put up there as an opposite to Yoni.

      When I first met Yoni on this site I was very grateful for his muscular and robust style of arguing.

      Whatever feelings put the flames into the argument between Daniel and Yoni are still beyond my powers of comprehension but since I happen to like them both I still suspect that in a minute or two both of them will burst into laughter exclaiming “we fooled you there, didn’t we?”.

      Your implying that the “purity” of your children and grand-children is endangered is pretty cheap by my book. Normally only whiners bring up stuff like that. I sincerely hope for your own good that you aren’t one of that kind.

      • Thanks, much appreciated, Silke, and a great post altogether.
        However, you are wrong on one point: there was/is no ‘fooling’ involved. See my reply to Kathy. I dared to make a comment that went against DM’s Weltanschauung. He took it as a personal affront that I hold different views from his. Briefly, he tried to make me backtrack and accept him as the great mentor, sage and guru that he is in his own lunchtime. I told him I’d have none of it, that I have my own opinions and I am planning to stick to them. That really, really pissed him off. Well, tough cheese. Ever since then, he’s made it his personal mission on this blog to stalk me and insult me, you know how.
        Now Gamil is shooting his mouth off non-stop. I wonder if he will also go into pre-moderation for his personal insults.

    • “I was quite upset when Yoni once again turned it into a place to vent his frustrations”
      You need to concentrate a little harder, dear. It was DM who started laying into me personally when I made a NON-PERSONAL comment about the racist aspect of Light Unto the Nations. It was DM who started laying into me personally when I made a mild comment about the difference between antisemitism and anti-Zionist in re Ahava. So, frankly, my dear, I don’t give a flying treefrog whether or not you are upset.
      As to my English being ‘atrocious’ … LOL. I can’t take this stupid comment as the rude insult it was designed to be, because it’s just so hilariously funny. I translate philosophy books etc into ‘atrocious’ English for well-known academic publishers. Still, laughing as I am, dear, take a hike.

  24. David Guy, I also bet they don’t celebrate Christmas. After all, how could they celebrate the birth of Jesus, the Jewish settler, on occupied “Palestinian” land?!

  25. Michael Goldman

    Kathy
    I applaud you!
    You sound like a sensitive caring human being who has managed to realize her dream of living in the Jewish homeland.
    Please don’t be too hard on Yoni who left his homeland only to be surprised that not everbody in England loves the Jews.
    Where you have succeeded he has failed and his self disgust is only too obvious.
    Please forgive him.

    • Trust me, silly boy, I don’t have any ‘self-disgust’.
      You, on the other hand, should have it in spades – and you would be justified in having it.

  26. “Yoni who left his homeland only to be surprised that not everbody in England loves the Jews.” (:

    Ha Ha! Yoni runs away from ‘his homeland’! He is making us very very happy. We want all the Zionists to be liveing in England.

    Maybe also I am better Zionist that he. I live in Isreal. Yes, Yoni you must to tell all the Isrealis to run away from Palestine and write on blogs in another places instead. We are liking hippo-criticals cowards.

    Maybe also you will tell Daniel or Michael and to run away from there imperialistic settlements and run to London. You can to make a blog together and we will have our Palestine.

    All the best,

    Gamil

  27. Michael Goldman

    Gamil
    Happily you underestimate the Jewish people.
    For every Yoni who tries to run away from our destiny we have a thousand Kathys who run to embrace it.

    • Go bugger yourself, Goldman. I haven’t run away from anything.
      You, on the other hand, probably ducked military service.

  28. Not in your wildest dreams Gamil. Not in your wildest dreams.

    I waited 2,000 years to return. This is my home and the is the home of my children. I’m not going anywhere.

  29. “This is my home and the is the home of my children. I’m not going anywhere.” Yes, but Yoni’s mother has also said this and her baby ran away.

    We have been here before and after you are all running away like Yoni we are still will be here! Maybe you are big Zionists but your children can be like Yoni also. We are going to see.

    • Gamil
      You are either delusional or have no history knowledge at all:
      ‘We have been here before…’ Wrong! Jews lived there and build their cities thousands years before Arabs even emerged as a nation, even Christians ruled ‘Palestine’ longer than your lot. When the Arabs started to come here?
      Like 200 years ago or so? Anyway, today is not your best day.
      You’ve got an F. Do you homework. Be a good boy.

  30. Gamil
    how’s the camel piss business progressing?

  31. Gamil,

    I’m tired, Sunday is a long day. I’ll answer you tomorrow. You know nothing about me or my children. Nobody is going anywhere.

    On second thoughts, I’m going to bed.

  32. Daniel was still sleeping! Ha! ha. Maybe a lot of raining!

    ‘We have been here before…’ Wrong! Jews lived there and build their cities thousands years before Arabs even emerged as a nation’ _ Eugene

    Yes Eugene. My great-great father is Ishmael. Your great-great father is Ibrahim. Who did come first? Look in your book!

    Eugene,

    This not important who lived, important who living now. You write that Jews lived THERE. So I can guess that you say THERE you are another ‘Zionist’ not in Isreal. I have no war and no problems with Jews who are like you. You are the good Jew because you are there and not here! Yours sons are not making checkpoints and gaurding the WALL.

    You make demon-stations there and come here on holidays that is fine and good. No problem. Soon many Isrealis will run away like Yoni and just to come to Palestine (or Isreal) for holidays.

    I have no war with you. Yoni is a good Jew also, he has ran away.

    I am hate Daniel and Michael also only because they are here not there. You are like my brothers!

    Regards,

    Gamil

    • OK Gamil.
      Let’s start: a) I’m not sure about Arabic translations of Hebrew names, but i think Ibrahim is Abraham and Ismail is Ishmael, son of Sara’s maiden, father usually comes before son. As for looking in MY book, i’m not a big scholar of Torah, but i’m pretty sure Ishmael was considered wicked, and Isaac son of Sara is regarded as Abraham’s true heir.
      So, another F for you.
      b) When i said lived, that means lived continuously, even after expulsions, wars etc., there’s was always Jewish presence in the Land of Israel. The fact that Arbas occupied Jewish lands doesn’t make it theirs (same with Greeks, Romans, Turkish, British and so on). You are not thinking that Moorish Spain should belong to the Berber Muslims aren’t you?
      And one more F… (I’ll leave you for another year repeat the course, seriously)
      c) And the final but not least important thing: i’m NOT a Jew, i have Jewish ancestors but i’m not Jewish (at least from what i know about my family)according to religious law, Zionist – yes, but not Jewish.

      Regards, Eugene

    • Piss off, antisemitic asshole. I haven’t run away. And your knowledge of history is as deficient as the number of your brain cells.

  33. Jonathan Hoffman

    I love the as-a-Jews in their Santa hats especially Queen Brucie

  34. Gamil,

    Actually I was learning Talmud, but I’ve finished. Now what exactly was your question?

  35. Richard has generated a lively debate without having to rely on qualitative contributions from Oberfuhrer Gert or young-at-heart Yoni.

    Regarding that nasty play, I have read the script and watched it on you tube, and was as disgusted as I was unimpressed.

    There is a very thin line between anti-semitism and anti-zionism, but a line nonetheless. For those that subscribe to the former, their freedom of expression is curtailed by political correctness. So for reasons of expedience, they invariably masquerade behind the mask of anti-zionism. And for what it us worth they even give anti-zionism a bad name.

    I believe Seven Jewish Children to be an unabashed and brazen anti-semitic work. It tries to gain recognition and legitimacy by exploring man’s inner nature, addressing the confrontation between good and evil, of virtue versus vice.

    Does Rousseau’s essential good prevail over Hobbe’s fundamental bad in our philosophical primordial state of being? The dark transformation from one to the other was taken to new lengths in modern literature, in Conrad’s Heart of Darkness and Golding’s Lord of the Flies. Seven Jewish Children was a shallow anti-semitic attempt to mimic these classics.

    I recently took my son to London to see the stage production of Oliver Twist.
    The scores of Jew hating slurs had been tempered since Dickens’ original script.
    Dickens never admitted to having been an anti-semite, or to even know the etymology of the term, which comes as little surprise since it was first coined several years after his death.

    Does that make the play any less anti-semitic? Did gravity only come into existence once Newton understood it? I failed to notice any demonstrations outside the Oliver Twist theatre.

    As far as Poland’s interpretation of anti-semitism is concerned, you need not look any further than the fresco adorning St Paul’s church in Sandomierz in Poland which shows Jews draining the blood of a young Christian boy.

    “Tell him it is raspberry juice”
    “Tell him he wanted us to have it”
    “Tell him West Ham are staying up.”

    One commentator wrote that you don’t need to make Yerida to England to discover that there is a lot of anti-semitism out there.

    “Jew hatred is a phenomenon lying deep in human psychology” Leon Pinsker.

    I know that the best way to to oppose the play and to confront anti-semitism, is not to adopt Yoni’s effort to buy more Israeli fruit and veg, but simply to come home.

    So please come home!

    • Nick,
      1. You don’t know my personal circumstances. Kindly don’t tell me what to do with my life, OK?
      2. I believe that Jews, especially now that we have a free country, are a nation like all nations. Members of all national are free to live in other countries. That applies to Jews, too.

  36. Okay, I’ll weigh in.

    I’m still of the opinion that Seven Jewish Children was anti-Zionist more than it was anti-Semitic. I further suspect that many of us, myself often included, would be incapable of accepting the possibility of the existence of the former without the latter, so for the sake of argument and somewhat moved by Kopaloff’s eloquent deliberation on the matter, I shall concede the point. Seven Jewish Children is an anti-Semitic play. So what?

    Is there a new law or ethic stating that all gentiles must love Jews and none must hate us? And if there is what exactly are they required not to hate? Our G-d..Our Torah? Plenty of Jews hate them too.

    Perhaps they are forbidden individually hate each and every Jew? If so, why stop at Jews? Let’s pass a law that nobody must hate anyone. Is that practical or moral?

    Is it Jewish gatherings or organizations that gentiles must not hate? Are they forbidden to hate synagogues? Again plenty of us do. Must they not hate Jewish schools or perhaps the Zionist Federation? Are thy forbidden to hate Jewish culture? All of it? Are they allowed to hate Woody Allen movies or Shalom Aleichem books? What exactly is it about us that is so lovable that turns anyone who hates us into an irrational monster?

    Obviously, those who don’t like us must not give concrete expression to their feelings by discrimination, prejudice, violence, incitement to the above etc. We must all behave decently too, but are they not allowed to hate us?

    For all those reason I don’t picket the Merchant of Venice nor would not teach Shakespeare or Dickens. Regarding the charges that the money from the play is going to Gaza, I guess I could agree, except for the fact that much of the taxation I pay goes there too and I don’t consider the Israeli government to be anti-Semitic…..yet.

    Finally, Kopaloff is right and I guess that as a Zionist I have lower expectations of my gentile brethren. Modern Political Zionism was, to a great extent, built on the realization by its founders that there would always be Antisemitism as long as the Jew lived among the nations. To many of its forerunners, especially the irreligious, it was exactly the understanding that the all gentiles could never be persuaded not to hate us that became the basis for the notion of a modern State of Israel. When Herzl heard the Paris crowds calling, “Death to the Jews!” and when his Zionist brothers in Russia experienced to Kishinev pogrom they didn’t organize pickets. They determined that it was time for our nation to return home!

    Regarding Gamil’s question I’ll get back to it. His is the hardest of all.

  37. Richard, what was the pro-Israel turnout?

  38. I’m always sorry I can’t come but it’s a bit of a schlep from North Tel Aviv.

  39. I just received a broadcast email from Sara Saber-Freedman of the Canada-Israel Committee, as follows:
    “We’re pleased to report another BUYcott Israel success story! Ahava products sold out at Lord and Taylor in Boston this weekend.
    Congratulations to Israel supporters in Boston and across the U.S. who participated in this BUYcott Israel event. BDS fails…again!”

  40. Gamil dribbles: “This not important who lived, important who living now”. From the mouth of babes, eh? The Jews are back and living in Hebron now. So cry your heart out, little boy.

  41. Daniel
    why you’re avoiding my answers? I going to remind you:

    “This is my home and the is the home of my children. I’m not going anywhere.” yes, but Yoni’s mother has also said this and her baby ran away. Might be she cryed and said, ‘Yoni, stay in Isreal with me!”

    Might you are big Zionists but your children can be like Yoni also. how you know that your children are not running away like Yoni and being good Jews outside Palestine (or Isreal), where is your answers Daniel?

    Eugene,
    I have not some argument or fight with you. Peace and long life also.

  42. Don’t talk about my mother, you filthy person.

  43. Yoni
    I have no argument or fight with you also. You have ran away from Palestine (or Isreal) and I love you. You are the good Jew. thank you!

    My arguments is with the Zionist like Daniel and Michael. I talked to Daniel and not with you. I did ask Daniel my question. I said that your mother maybe she cryed and wet nose and said, ‘Yoni, stay in Isreal with me because we must to be Zionists!’ but you said ‘No mother, I can to be a good Jew out of Israel and also will have a good job with transalating!’.

    I want the answer of Daniel not you.

  44. DM asks: “And if there is what exactly are they required not to hate?”
    They are not ‘required’ to do or not do anything. Certainly, it has nothing to do with hating or not hating the Torah or god (the latter, btw, is an English noun, it’s not the ineffable name of Judaism’s deity and it’s not even in Hebrew). Those are abstract religious concepts. One can hate all religions or a particular religion, but that has nothing to do with racism (except, of course, that in today’s deranged Britain, thanks to the totalitarian tendencies of those who wish to appease the easily insulted members of the religion of you-know-what, thought crime against those particular sensitive souls is now effectively on the statute books once again masquerading as ‘racism’; but for the moment I am talking about sane societies).
    Jews, OTOH, are people, and we are talking about the people who make up one particular nation. Hate qua hate is not the problem: it’s hate that involves incitement to actual physical harm to particular people based on their ethnicity or nation that’s the issue. That really is racism, and incitement to racist hatred is rightly considered a crime in civilised societies, because it harms actual real people.
    I see that DM has, reluctantly, conceded the point about the play, but it seems to me that he doesn’t know why he conceded it. This is not mere semantics, as he perhaps still thinks. It’s the actual lives of actual people that are at stake. Jews have been physically attacked on the streets of London, and those who run amuck in the streets calling for their blood have little if anything to fear. Some of them are feted by MPs and mayors. So despite DM’s pooh-poohing, the fact is that Britain is in the grip of a tidal wave of Jew-hatred from two very clear if mutually supporting directions, and any play being staged in this environment that encourages that hatred is not simply a little piece of theatre we needn’t concern our heads about, as those naive people thought 80 years ago. It’s tantamount to shouting ‘Fire!’ in a crowded theatre, which is rightly a punishable crime.
    Now, I objected to DM’s characterisation of this play as ‘only’ anti-Zionist, but that was because I regard the ‘only anti-Zionist’ excuse for antisemitism (when coming from its proponents, I hasten to add) as cowardly and contemptible to the nth degree. Anti-Zionists deny the right of the Jewish nation to live in its own national homeland, but they don’t similarly deny the same right to Norwegians and Japanese, to Egyptians and Greeks, or even to the mythical ‘Palestinians’. That makes them antisemites. And they don’t even have the guts to say so.

  45. Yoni
    However, you are wrong on one point: there was/is no ‘fooling’ involved.

    a gal must be allowed to dream her dreams and not matter what the facts are, in this case I’ll stick to hope over (apparent) facts.

  46. ‘I am a Zionist, you utterly hateful and filthy little man.’

    But why are you not teaching all teaching all the Zionist to run away also and transalating. The Palestinian People are needing many ‘Zionists’ like you. 5,000,000 Zionist like Yoni and all the Jews gone back to Poland.

    Yoni you are like my brother. Say to you mother she must not to cry for her Yoni.
    You are a hero!

  47. And you are a filthy waste of space. And a dumb antisemite. The Jews don’t come from Poland. Oh, and there is no ‘Palestinian people’ any more than there is a Laputan people.

  48. Gamil,

    As far as I can understand you are asking how I know that my children will have the same ideology as me and that they will stay in Israel and not run away.

    Firstly, let me say that I agree with you about one thing. The argument is between you and I. It is us who must find a way to live together and if we can’t our children will have to fight as we have fought. I also think that in many ways your children have more to lose than mine. Obviously I’m not talking about you and your children specifically. I don’t know you or them, but I sincerely wish you all well.

    Regarding the first question, I don’t. I don’t know if all my children will have my ideology. They are all different and they are each building their own world. Amichai is the Liberal, he’s studying to be a lawyer but he’ll spend his life helping people. Dina is the Socialist, maybe she’ll build a new kibbutz, next year she begins her studies at the Technion. Rachelle is still young; she’ll be a soldier next year. I think she’s the least religious and the most beautiful. Ariel is only 11 and a genius. Who knows? He asked me today if I could see him as a rabbi. I said yes and he told me I was crazy.

    They’re all different. I don’t want them all to have my ideology, or perhaps that is my ideology. They all love Israel. They all adore Israel in different ways and there is nothing I love more than trekking with them over our sacred hills and in the holy valleys.

    Do I know if any of them will leave Israel? Nobody can be sure of anything. However, I know one thing. If any of them does, it will be my failure not theirs. I will be angry, but deep down the anger will be at myself. We pray three times a day that G-d may return us all to Zion in mercy. If any of them leave, maybe they didn’t pray enough, maybe I didn’t.

    Gamil, don’t hold your breath waiting. They may leave, but I think that the chance of the messiah coming tomorrow is much greater. I think you’d be better off to find a way that we can all live together in peace, you, me, my children and your children.

  49. Gamil is not a real person. He is someone just indulging in a prank.

  50. Michael Goldman

    Yoni
    I’m really having trouble understanding your anger with Gemil.
    He is in full agreement with you that you should be living in England.
    It’s easy for you to be aggressive towards Palestinians from 2000 miles away.
    Here we realise we have to find a solution to the problem and being insulting (especially when it really isn’t really your problem) really doesn’t help.

    • Nonsense. Gamil is (insultingly) dictating to me that I should be living in England. I am a Jew. I am 100% entitled to live in Israel. There is no ‘agreement’ between us.
      And it’s not my problem? Take a flying jump.

  51. Goldman makes a fair point.

    I have no idea whether Gamil or Adam or even Yoni are real names or really exist. Sillke I know personally, by emails.

    Either way Gamil (or the Gamils of this world) is OUR enemy, not that of Jews or non-Jews living abroad. If there’s another war or Intifada or whatever it’s us and our children who are at risk.

    For all these reasons, this really is a Israel-Arab conflict. If there must be compromises they’ll be Arabs and Israelis making them.

    We appreciate support from our friends but that does not include them telling us what to do. If we (Arabs and Jews alike) make mistakes, they must be ours because we’ll be the ones who will have to pay for them. I know it’s often easy for football supporters to get confused and believe that they are the ones playing and that they all understand better than their teams players, trainer etc but at the end of the day they are supporters and though their cheering may help, it’s rarely decisive.

    And this is no game. It is our lives and the lives of our sons and daughters, Ours not yours. We will not tell you how to run the Anglo-Jewish community or in Adam’s case how to conduct your countries internal or foreign policy. I think that we deserve similar respect.

    • I am not ‘ telling you what to do’. I am expressing an opinion about Israel. I bought the right to do so through my 4 years in the IDF, if nothing else.
      By your logic, you have no right to express an opinion about a play staged in London. Are you honest enough to admit that?

  52. Whether Gamil Elias is real or a fictitious altered ego is for the most part immaterial. His chilling contributions to this blog are imperative.

    Unlike Oberfuhrer Gert, who masquerades as a liberal humanist, or Yoni who can nip down to his local Diaspora greengrocer and negotiate the purchase of Israeli-grown fruit and veg in near-fluent Aramaic, Gamil is a “WYSIWYG” – What You See Is What You Get.
    He is the personification of the difference between Fatah and Hamas.
    He says exactly what he thinks – he is the devil with horns – and for his honesty and transparency you have to respect him.

    However, there is a popular urban myth that may throw light as to his genealogy – and verify his authenticity.

    When my unit was stationed next to Beit Lehem, there was a notorious “Elias” woman who allegedly used to offer her carnal services to all and sundry including Israeli servicemen for little more than the cost of can of army bully beef. Rumour has it, that she later gave birth to a son she called Gamil “Luff” Elias

    When young Gamil would see Israeli soldiers in uniform, he would shout out “Daddy?”
    to which the soldiers would reply “I Didn’t Fuckher”. Hence the acronym I.D.F.

    If Gamil is real, and as is customary with those of his ilk, I should be given the death penalty for defaming the honour of his family.

    I await sentence.

    • Where are you living Nick ?

      If I will find you you will be praying I don’t exist and am hoax or prank!

    • Your sarcastic reference to Aramaic – and the rest of your snide comments about me – mean that I won’t engage with you, because all you want to do is score cheap points. You are pathetic.

  53. I have little to add to Kopaloff’s characteristically articulate attempt to probe the mystery of Gamil’s origins. Other than to explain that luff is a bastardization of the British Armed Forces’s meat loaf.

    Without doubt, the evergreen Nick articulated what many of us many of us were sensing. There are many personalities on this blog that seem larger than life and late at night do we never ponder whether they are all of skin and bones and muscles as we are. Does Eugene really exist or is this thoughtful, Zionist too-good-to-be-true gentile the product of someone’s fertile imagination? Perhaps mine, perhaps yours.

    Is there really a Kathy Olsson or are her and her beloved offspring just cyber creations? Her name cannot be found in the Jerusalem telephone directory. How understandable for an aging, virtual granny to need her seclusion.

    Is there really a fruit and veg consuming, Aramaic scholar called Yoni or is he someone’s Mr Hyde, and if, so who is Dr. Jekyll? Perhaps the implausible Michael Goldman. He always appears far too temperate.

    In the final analysis these questions may transpire to be less important than they appear at first glance. Few bloggers have met me, but I’m pretty sure that I exist. I could, of course, be the invention of some armchair Zionist in Golders Green, vicariously settling the land of his fathers. I might disappear when he turns off his laptop to take the tube to an uninspiring place of work. If so, why take away his delight?
    Let me live!

    • Hi Daniel,
      I know it’s hard to believe but i do really exist (definitely saw myself in the mirror today). Even more, i also from Eastern Europe and yes i’m gentile.
      Of course it’s looks to hard to be true, but then how do we know that all those protestesters are genuine ones? Could be another Jewish conspiracy to bring publicity and scam us of all our money again🙂
      Sad true that all those Gamils are really exist, maybe not here, but they are among us. I met to many of them to know that.
      I don’t care if someone believe in my existence or not, i do what i feel is right ant the true is on my side and that’s enough for me.

  54. What are you all nattering on about?

    There are, what? 300,000 odd Jews in the UK, including some ex-Israelis? Well, there are 5,700,000 Jews in Israel and growing. So a Yoni here or there is not more than a drop in the sea, really.

    Sorry to disappoint, but we’re not running away, dears. Not only are we not running away, our society is vibrant, our economy robust and even the sun is out again, cracking the flags, after a stormy weekend.

    • Beautifully put Imshin!

      I saw a rainbow that followed the rain and remembered G-d’s covenant with us, but I never thought of raising a flag. He put up all those colors, I can raise blue and white. They are majestic in the wind.

      I shall do that tomorrow morning.

  55. And the same comments to the eternally disgusting DM, who can never let an opportunity go by without scoring cheap points by referring to Aramaic. The most disgusting part is that he sets himself up as a wise scholar and sage, above cheap sarcasm and barbed insults (remember his pompous reference to the 3 and 4 things that god detests?), and yet he is just a non-stop kindergarten bully who commits those 3 and 4 things day in day out. In a post last night, I addressed his previous post about antisemism factually and logically. I hoped he might see that as a suggestion that he stop sniping at me, and I will then refrain likewise. The result? Well, of course the result is that he is continuing his sniping. A thoroughly disgusting excuse for a human being.

    • The story is told of the man who goes to a psychologist and says:

      “Doctor, I think I have an inferiority complex.”

      The shrink examines him conscientiously, only to return to his patient with the diagnosis:

      “The good news is that you don’t have an inferiority complex. The bad news is that you really are inferior.”

      I’ve never called myself a guru, scholar or sage. I’m just an ageing West Bank settler impoverished of deeds, trembling and frightened from the dread of Him Who is enthroned upon the praises of Israel.

      I teach in a yeshiva where young men half my age have learned know twice the Talmud that I will ever know. Every day my students call me “HaRav” (the rabbi) and I tell them that I am no rabbi, nor do I reach the heals of their feet.

      My wife knows more psychology than I, my son knows more philosophy, I and my daughter knows more Bible. I am no guru; elderly perhaps, but neither a scholar nor sage. I have never claimed any of those titles for myself and anyone who sees me as them is an idle flatterer or fool.

  56. Silke,
    Yes, it had occurred to me that Gamil is a hoax, in fact most likely a black flag operation designed to make antisemites look thoroughly stupid. Objective achieved🙂

  57. Michael Goldman

    Back to the discussion of this morning.
    Daniel
    I will have to differ with you here.
    I have no problem with being advised by other people on how to run my country even if they don’t live here.
    All advise is welcome.
    Yoni
    I still don’t understand why tou are angry with Gemil.
    He tells you not live somewhere you don’t want to live anyway.
    If here were to tell me not to live in Micronesia or for that matter England it wouldn’t bother me one bit!

  58. Sigh … Gamil is telling me that I am not entitled to live in Israel.
    Is that clear enough for you?

  59. Michael Goldman

    Not in the slightest.
    YOU DON’T WANT TO LIVE HERE !
    SO WHAT DOES IT MATTER?
    You have decided you would rather be British that Israeli.
    Gamil congratulates you on your bold decision.
    You’re both on the same team!
    You just don’t see it!

  60. Ah well, what is there to say to a self-admitted idiot who can’t see the difference between my position and that of someone who tells all Jews to bugger off back to Poland … At least it proves the untenability of the position that all Jews are intelligent.

  61. Michael Goldman

    OK Yoni
    Now the real question
    Why do you think it is that those of us on the blog who left England to realise the Zionist dream take Gamil’s comments with a pinch of salt even though his insults and threats are directed at us, and you Yoni, who found yourself incapable of realising that same Zionist dream, but rather decided to make his home in England, get so upset by his demands that you not live in a country you have no intention of living in anyway??
    Why is nobody here as upset as you?

  62. Christ on a stick, do you ever engage your brain? How do you know that I am “incapable of realising that same Zionist dream”? How do you know that I “have no intention of living in [Israel] anyway”?
    Your feverish assumptions shouldn’t be confused with reality, don’t you know, old bean.

  63. Q. I still don’t understand why tou are angry with Gemil.
    He tells you not live somewhere you don’t want to live anyway. (Michael)

    A. Sigh … Gamil is telling me that I am not entitled to live in Israel.
    Is that clear enough for you? (Yoni)

    It’s an interesting dialogue and one worthy of some reflection. For those of us old enough to remember the glorious “Life of Brian”, a parallel debate takes place:

    “Stan: I want to be a woman. From now on, I want you all to call me Loretta.

    Reg: What?

    Loretta: It’s my right as a man.

    Judith: Well, why do you want to be Loretta, Stan?

    Loretta: I want to have babies.

    Reg: You want to have babies?!

    Loretta: It’s every man’s right to have babies if he wants them.

    Reg: But…you can’t have babies!

    Loretta: Don’t you oppress me!

    Reg: I’m not oppressing you, Stan. You haven’t got a womb. Where is the fetus going to gestate? You’re going to keep it in a box?

    Loretta: Sniff.

    Judith: Here, I’ve got an idea. Suppose you agree that he can’t actually have babies, not having a womb, which is nobody’s fault, not even the Romans’, but that he can have the right to have babies.

    Rogers: Good idea, Judith. We shall fight the oppressors for your right to have babies, brother. Sister! Sorry.

    Reg: What’s the point?

    Rogers: What?

    Reg: What’s the point of fighting for his right to have babies, when he can’t have babies?

    Rogers: It is symbolic of our struggle against oppression.

    Reg: Symbolic of his struggle against reality.”

    Likewise Yoni feels that Gamil is oppressing him by denying his right to live in Israel, which he has chosen not to do.

    Therefore, in the interest of bring about a swift solution to at least of Yoni’s numerous problems I suggest the following formula. I think should be acceptable to both him and Gamil. If we hear nothing from either within two hours we will consider this to be the case, and that peace has been restored:

    Suppose we agree that he doesn’t actually live in Israel, which is nobody’ else’s fault, not even the Arabs’, but that he can have the right to have live in Israel.

    For the entertainment of our readers I also offer the earliest forerunner of the Goldman-Yoni dispute. Make a note of the big kippot!

  64. Sorry about the many typos. I must be tired. – Goodnight.

  65. Goldman and Marks, I don’t see your problem. Yoni is Jewish. He has a right to live in Israel, or in the UK. You know nothing of his reasons for being in the UK at the moment. He is entitled to express opinions.

    So what’s your problem?

  66. Michael Goldman

    Adam
    I don’t have a problem.
    I’m just trying to understand Yoni’s demand to have the right to live in a place in which he doesn’t wish to live.

    Yoni
    I know you are incapable of realising the Zionist dream because though you are a staunch Zionist as you have told us, you haven’t actually realised the dream.
    I must however concede the second point.
    All Israelis living abroad have intentions to come home….They just don’t quite make it.
    By the way you haven’t answered my question.
    Are you incapable of answering it?
    Do you have intentions to answer it?
    Or is it just that you don’t like the the answer ?
    Daniel
    It’s a fine compromise.
    I do however think that Gemil might want Yoni to guarantee that though he has the right to live in Israel, he will never realise that right….on second thoughts I think that even Gemil sees the improbability of this happening.

  67. Goldman you are the lieing beach (lady dog) and I am spitting on your moustache!

    I was never saying:
    “You get so upset by his (that is me Gamil) demands that you not live in a country you have no intention of living in anyway??”

    I never have told Yoni or “demands” that he not live in Palestine (or Isreal). He did make decisions himself to make cheap transalations or might be a happy taxi driver. Yoni is a good man!

    I and no Arabs didn’t “demands” that he will not live here. I said just that I am happy🙂 that he went. I said he is good Jew and has rights to live anywhere else. He can to fly back also if he will want; to mummy, OK?
    So now you are a dirty lier!

    Regards,

    Gamil

    PS I rejcted the offer!

  68. I have been prevented from directly engaging with Yoni, because of his resentment at my references to Israel-grown Aramaic cucumbers.

    The mention of this or indeed any other Holy Land vegetable in any language or dialect has little effect on Michael Goldman or Daniel Marks. The citing of a Galilean turnip in Armenian or a Jerusalem artichoke in Swahili does little to rustle their feathers. So I will engage them instead.

    Michael, Daniel and I, have close relatives living in the UK, yet we would be loath to address them in the same vernacular and inflection as we do to Yoni. Do we know the personal circumstances that brought him to English shores? Do we know his hopes and aspirations of returning to his ancestral home? No, we do not.
    We know that just like Richard and Adam, Yoni’s heart is in the right place, while we contend that his, and their domicile, would be better served on more hallowed ground.
    For all Yoni’s misplaced anger management issues, he did serve in the IDF for 4 years. That is one year more than the mandatory 3. Either he signed on for an extra year or served a stretch in prison. But in either case, it was more than any of us.

    So in your names and on your behalf, I apologize to him in this respect, and I bring closure to this painful altercation. And now, let’s move on.

    • Thank you, appreciated.
      And no, I never set foot inside 4 or 6. I did manage one brief episode in the stockade, I think I was all of 2 hours before my CO realised he’d overreacted. It’s all a bit hazy. I think I tried sneaking into the mess 30 seconds after official timeout, as I’d been on duty without food for 16 hours, and the adjutant decided this was a major crime. My CO disagreed, as I recall.

  69. AN OPEN LETTER AND CALL FOR PEACE

    Nick et al

    Actually, Yoni and I have few bones of contention other than the largely academic question as to whether a ten minute play staged recently in London was anti-Zionist or Anti-Semitic. After your Nick’s celebrated elucidation earlier this week I have gracefully conceded the point and have boldly and unreservedly stated that the Seven Jewish Children were anti-Semitic as well as abhorrent, abominable and appalling. On Thursday night (PG) the walls of Mea Shearim and Bnei Brak will be bejeweled with loud black and white notices in Hebrew, Yiddish and Aramaic in which Guru Daniel Marks will call upon his faithful, frum followers to not see the show or step within 100 meters of the theater, unless they are doing so for journalistic or Zionist reasons as did the writer of this excellent blog and most of the rest of the audience on the aforementioned eve.

    Without conceding that any bullying has taken place, I shall further commit to being as nice as I can to all parties, however odious I may consider some of them, personally.

    That shall be my contribution to the peace process that is finally taking place on this revered blog. I call upon Kathy to make no further insinuations about Yoni’s English fluency or lack of it and upon Nick to limit his references to the latter’s Aramaic prowess to an absolute minimum.

    I call upon Gamil to accept Yoni’s theoretical right to live in Israel, and a covert clause may be added to the effect that such a right will not be exercised in the “foreseeable future”. I also call upon him to engage Yoni in angry debate, from time to time, as he would had the latter never left Israel.

    I call upon Yoni to freeze unilaterally any further expansion in his fruit and veggie purchases for a three month period until final status talks are concluded. Likewise while recognizing his inalienable right to slag off anyone on the blog who upsets or he feels is bullying him, I call upon him to exercise restraint in the case of Kathy for reasons of age and sensitivity.

    Michael Goldman is called upon not to ask Yoni questions that he doesn’t want to answer, or can’t, and to respect his right to evade tricky issues such as why he left Israel etc.

    Adam and Eugene are recognized as “honest brokers” in this matter and are invited to monitor the implementation of the proposed agreement providing short bi-annual reports highlighting any breaches. They may consult with other neutral experts such as the lovely Silke over linguistic matters.

    Any objections?

  70. Michael Goldman

    Nick
    You have known me many years and as such can guess that I am not so easily appeased.
    I oppose your peace proccess in its entirity but would rather begin a “Yoni Come Home, you know that you want to!” campaign.
    As such I ask, nay DEMAND that all true Zionists rally behind me in this holy crusade!

  71. Michael Goldman,
    Notwithstanding a friendship that spans for more decades than I care to recall, and one which has survived the test of you having slept with two of my girlfriends, your hardline intransigence is overshadowed by your poor choice of phrase. And herein lies the tragedy of it all.

    Your woeful call for Yoni, Richard and Adam to join you in a “Holy Crusade” brings to mind that same faux pas uttered from the lips of no other than President Bush- to embark on a Holy Crusade – and rid the Holy Land of the infidel, (and slaughter entire Jewish communities on the way). That is a far cry from the Zionism that fuels our existence, and one from which I am sure you would now like to distance yourself.

    For even the infidel has a place in my Land of Israel.

    I had to learn the hard way, to respect the sensitivities of fellow contributors, and to think at least twice, before making mention of any exotic vegetables in foreign tongues. I implore you to follow my lead and think before you submit a posting you will live to regret.

  72. Michael Goldman

    So are you in or are you out?

  73. as to crusades and crusaders

    the only ones I perceive in our times to indulge in an endeavour that reminds me of crusades are the Jihadists.

    Why? first of all because of their eagerness to kill Jews but also because not least they indulge like the crusaders did more often than not in massacring their fellow believers.

    I am not much into the history of the crusades but enough to remember the atrocities inflicted on “apostates” during the Cathar Albigensian Crusade. The conquest of Constantinople in 1204 by a crusade is another example which I think is suitable to serve as analogy and should be well remembered these days, because it is a good early example of how the “west” failed to get its act together preferring to go for one another and thus opened the barn doors for the advance of Muslim forces.

  74. I am shocked to hear the generally prudent Nick raking up what can only be described as filth from a friend’s past, and mention being made of a long-forgotten alleged romantic threesome, and all that in a brazen attempt coerce Goldman’s support for his now infamous offering of remorse to Yoni.

    I think I would be revealing little if I were to say that Kopaloff “knew” so many lady-friends at that time, that no carnal associates need fear that their names be divulged. Rumor has it that one disgruntled ex-lover attempted to upload the list to Wikilinks and its European server collapsed for five hours. Eventually he gave up trying.

    Goldman has more than once gone down on the record as having expressed regret for the incident. In his defense he argued that in those days and in that place it was hard to find a couple of tarts who had never been Kopaloff’s “girlfriends”, especially not in London, especially not at midnight.

    Thankfully, the peace road map that I outlined has gathered impetus off-blog and off its subjects only Goldman has expressed some moderate objection.

    No less importantly, facts established “on the ground” and neither has Kopaloff made an reference to Yoni’s ample adroitness in ancient Aramaic nor Goldman has asked him any more tricky questions.

    Yoni has indicated though a third party, and with characteristic subtly and discretion, that while the terms may not be “ideal”, there is certainly potential for the establishment of a framework which in the course of time, and at an appropriate juncture could further conditions facilitating negotiations of a settlement.

    Rome was not Built in a Day! (Yes, Nick. I know that the Romans destroyed the temple)

  75. I object vehemently to women indulging in and hopefully enjoying one-night-stands to be called “tarts”.

    We have the same right as men have to figure out in real life whether there is any merit in it without being called names for it.

  76. Tart = prostitute: a woman who engages in sexual intercourse for money

    http://wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn?s=tart

    Though I am lacking in both knowledge experience in this are, I’m guessing that the most enjoyable part of a tart’s evening is the moment of payment rather than the “indulging” bit.

    Anyway:

    “Happy is the man whose job is also his hobby.”

    In an early blog I recall you saying that you had worked somewhere in Germany near a pick-up point for whores and had developed a respect for them. Did you ever ask them that question? Bet you did.

    Now, on a totally unrelated note; we would all be very appreciative if you could talk to Yoni off-blog and get him on board with this peace plan. I believe that you and Richard are the only two regulars here who have earned the unreserved respect of all sides. One word of advice, however. Mention neither Aramaic nor his fruit and veg purchases!

  77. It looks like Gamil is only interested in terrorizing Israeli Jews into leaving, in which case he leaves Israeli Jews only one choice: terrorize lest they be terrorized.

    Is this Gamil prominent among the anti-Ahava lot?

    ‘Yes Eugene. My great-great father is Ishmael. Your great-great father is Ibrahim. Who did come first? Look in your book!’

    Abraham/Ibrahim, obviously.

  78. These days one calls women AND men who provide sex for money in English apparently “sex workers”, in German Prostitutes is OK and Hure also.

    Both are expressions that their respresentatives approve of , though they seem to be in favour of Hure (I think there is something nice in the etymology).
    As these are women who work for a living i.e. live at nobody’s I care to call them what they want to be called, and tart or its German equivalents it definitely isn’t.
    BTW they need representatives because the state collects taxes but doesn’t allow membership in our health services, at least that’s how it was until recently.

    Their customers of course have all the rights to all benefits any other tax paying citizen is entitled to.

    Tart very definitely is not OK as especially in connection with “girl-friend” it suggests that women indulging in sexual freedoms are to be judged by different standards than men.

    I came close to Prostitutes, professionals and amateurs i.e. kept office colleagues, several times in my life. I talked to them like to any other decent woman whom I wasn’t close enough to discuss sex and its pleasures or plights with.

    I don’t discuss peace plans with nobody – as IMHO one side qualifies as “unreliable partner” and I stick to one of my few basic rules: avoid as much as possible to enter a contract with an unreliable partner – thus I consider almost all I read about peace plans as smacking of containing quite some delusions.
    Other than that Israel is a sovereign state and whatever she does or does not is OK by me, I am “interested” in people who indulge in slandering.

  79. Reread the paragraph:

    In his defense he argued that in those days and in that place it was hard to find a couple of tarts who had never been Kopaloff’s “girlfriends”, especially not in London, especially not at midnight.

    Why do you think the word girlfriends was in inverted commas?

    I have no idea what you cryptically meant by:

    “..one side qualifies as “unreliable partner”

    There are many sides involved as Yoni simultaneously does battle with most Israelis on this blog and most anti-Israelis. I believe it would be in everyone’s best interest to pursue peace and harmony:

    All we are saying is give peace a chance!

  80. in the world I used to live in one-night-stand sused to get agreed upon more often than not around midnight.

    If you mean sex workers say so, no reason to call them tarts or “girl-friends”
    I have worked for a living, provided for myself and so they do.

  81. I’ve always considered attempts to project current politically correct terminology or images into historical situation alien to them somewhat anachronistic.

    In the 1970s, when our story takes place, that was exactly how prostitutes were called on a good day. The dictionary I referred you to (2010) offers also:

    prostitute, cocotte, whore, harlot, bawd, cyprian, fancy woman, working girl, sporting lady, lady of pleasure, woman of the street

    A modern thesaurus also suggests:

    bimbo, broad, doxy, easy make, hooker, moll, nympho, piece of tail, prostitute , tramp, whore

    I have not interviewed the ladies in question to discover their preference or favorite job description is, though I suspect that few have the expression “piece of tail” printed on their business cards. It’s also interesting to ask the chicken vs egg question; was it the act of selling sex that gave theses words a bad reputation of visa versa?

    Regarding the expression “Sex Worker” it sounds incredibly sterile and sexless and I’m sure must be bad for business. It conjures up the image of a woman in a dental hygienist’s uniform short bleached hair tied in a neat pony tale and smelling of cheap green mouthwash. The fact the term is used in Germany does not surprise me at all, as it is as descriptive and unerousing as the legendary bustenhalter.

    Silke, show a hundred red-blooded gents a picture of a “sex worker” with or without her “bustenhalter” and I guarantee the excitement will be less than that aroused by Yoni’s Aramaic Cucumber.

    While you know how much I genuinely respect and like you personally, I shall continue to exercise linguistic autonomy and make my own choice of words and expressions to use.

  82. Quite some time before the 1970s a lot of us women and a lot of enlightened guys had started to feel uneasy about calling prostitutes derogatory names. By the advent of the 70s we probably dominated the use of language and any guy or gal using out of fashion terminology had a hard time convincing “us” that it was a blunder out of ignorance and thoughtlessness not one out of conviction.

    It happened to be my birthday party in 1967 when we stood up for our gay colleague against our dinosaur male friends by asking him to bring his partner along. The “straight” guys protested and we told them they’d either behave or leave. Nobody left and the party lasted well into the wee hours.

    So don’t give me that crap that I know nothing about the 70s and btw London at the time seemed always to be way ahead of us clumsy and backward Germans.

    If you’d do me the honour of reading what I wrote you’d find that I said the term sex worker is an English one. I can’t remember having heard anything similarly gender neutral in Germany. Yes there is a German word Büstenhalter but you’ll hardly ever hear it, it is called BH (Beha) not much more phantasies inducing but not much worse than bra.

    Go on exercising linguistic autonomy while I continue to decide with great autonomy when I feel the need to defend the “linguistic” honour of my co-working gal sisters.

  83. Michael Goldman

    The girls (and sometimes their mothers(once or twice even their fathers)) would throw themselves at Nick like a starving man would throw himself at an oily latke in Bloom’s on Golders Green Road.
    Daniel on the other hand would have to work harder and often settle for much less, but he was always up to the challenge.
    I was always much more bashfull of the fairer sex (or in Daniel’s case not always fairer) and you can therefore imagine my surprise to hear about not one but two maidens about which I remember nothing.
    And no less than “Nick Gvae Me One” girls (which I believe is how they refered to themselves) which would definately have been a step up the ladder.
    Even Daniel’s relegating the poor girls to ladies of the night cannot tarnish my pride.
    I am tonight a proud man, though I remember not a thing!

  84. This is the time to reveal that, as both Adam and Silke have already guessed, Michael Goldman does not exist but is a cyber-creation of the ever proloific Nick Kopaloff, its job being to exaggerate Nick’s accomplishments and to make all us amateur pen pushers read like Willy Shakespeare in comparison.

    It is now to be hoped that with my exposure of this elaborate internet hoax, the already somewhat predictable and cliched character will finally be replaced by someone more interesting and believable – perhaps a retired, Cockney, anti-Zionist sex-worker of the 70s.

  85. Michael Goldman

    Wow!
    Does that mean I don’t have to pay taxes?

  86. Daniel
    you are into fantasies,
    Michael Goldman has never inspired me to guess anything. I have always taken him at face value.
    Please get your facts right.
    I suspect though that Gamil is a hoax who in real life is an ardent Zionest in love with his country
    Why do I suspect that? Because even I know more about camels.

  87. Few will be surprised to hear that I too not exist but am a “Black Flag Project” conceived and orchestrated by the ingenious Silke in an effort to make Modern-Orthodox Right-Wing Zionists appear far more clever and multi-dimensional than we really are.

    The creation of the Daniel Marks fabrication has required painstaking research in many areas from Rabbinic Jewish Law to Modern Chess Theory and the history of boxing. Reaching such levels of genius and wit on such a frequent basis has required the concerted effort of a ten man committee of experts in various areas who thanklessly and voluntarily gave of their time and resources.

    Unfortunately, the project has incurred heavy debts and with present financial constraints it looks likely that it will be forced to close down, at least for the time being. A skeleton staff of student volunteers will continue to make occasional postings.

  88. More drivel:
    “I know you are incapable of realising the Zionist dream”
    You know no such thing. Once again, your hallucinations are not the same thing as the actual physical world. Maybe you need to increase the dosage, or decrease it, or change the prescription entirely.

  89. I appreciate the conciliatory tones of some of the above posts, while continuing to hold that even some of those are written in a firmly sarcastic register. I will reply to some of them as I find the time to do so. The ones who continue in the same snotty and superior vein as before, I intend to grace with nothing more than a very loud raspberry.
    I certainly do not undertake not to live in Israel at any time I jolly well choose to do so, nor to refrain from buying any produce as and when the mood takes me, to wit, continue to buy Israeli produce whenever I can do so.
    I don’t believe that I am obliged to disclose on a public blog my family and personal circumstances, incl. in so far as they pertain to where I happen to live at this time. This is not a show trial in the USSR, where confessions were expected (truthful or not, usually the latter).
    More anon.

    • OBJECTION!
      No Israeli stuff for 3 months,
      I’m the broker you know…

      • What do you have in mind Eugene? To me 75% sounds more than reasonable. Perhaps we could add a clause allowing for “natural expansion”?

        It just seems so tragic that the Arab is saying “yes” and we are the ones turning him down. I believe Gamil to basically be a moderate and I’m scared that if we can’t offer him something concrete that he can take home to his people, he could be replaced by extremists who will return to hard-line fruit and veg positions.

  90. Michael Goldman

    Yoni
    It seems obvious that it’s time to move on.
    So stop getting bogged down and keep up with the pace

  91. Also I agree for most of the agreement.

    Yoni my brother. The deal is”

    “I call upon Yoni to freeze unilaterally any further expansion in his fruit and veggie purchases for a three month period until final status talks are concluded”

    You can to buy fruit and veg only not FURTHER EXPANSION (more then 75%)

    This is very very fairy!

  92. Yoni,

    I too am delighted that we’ve all calmed down a little. Perhaps it is the festive season that fills our hearts with joy and feelings of good will to all men.

    I, for my part, bear no grudge whatsoever about anything that was said about me. If I have offended anyone, it goes without saying that I sincerely and unreservedly beg forgiveness.

    On a related note, an apology to Kathy might be a gesture worthy of consideration. I honestly don’t think that she meant to offend you, but was actually trying to be nice. Likewise, I’m sure her comments about Israelis were not directed at you personally and, after all, she is someone’s grandmother. Anyway, after giving the matter due thought you will doubtlessly do what you consider prudent.

    Regarding your fruit and vegetable purchases, I’m not sure it was judicious to have made them an issue in the first place. The problem being, that once their extent had become public knowledge, it was only a matter of time before the Arabs would call for a vegetable freeze. Moreover, while I doubt that any great harm will be caused by your refusal to comply, as usual I would urge restraint wherever possible. The only exception might be avocado pears. I have lately found that half an avocado eaten daily with my breakfast does keep me surprisingly regular.

    All the best and seasonal greetings,

    Daniel

  93. If only you “move on” promoting guys would heed your own advice …

  94. Michael Goldman

    I just wish Yoni would stop bringing his vegtable purchses into every discussion.

  95. I agree,

    Yoni’s possibilities for buying Israel-grown vegetables make me so green with envy that I am in danger of developing ulcers from the feeling.

    Last year I got hold of some Israel-grown Paprika twice!!!
    this year I found Israel-grown Grapefruit twice!!!
    but alas none of those deliciously sweet Paprika

    but maybe next year …

    Why can Brits buy in great variety what I can’t buy in Germany?

  96. “I just wish Yoni would stop bringing his vegtable purchses into every discussion”

    So much pompous huffing and puffing, so little self-awareness. Scroll back, if you know how to, and you’ll see who keeps mentioning my vegetable purchases ad nauseam.

  97. The original topic of this blog was the decline in the number of anti-Ahava demonstrators last Shabbat (Parshat Vayigash). How the devil did we all lose the thread? I point no fingers here; If anyone is guilty, we are all guilty.

    Regarding Yoni’s seemingly unending Zionist fruit and veg saga, there is nothing left to say, not in English, not in Hebrew and , dare I say it, not even in Aramaic.

    This page is as spent as Goldman was after as his incredibly quickie with those two toothless old cockney ladies of pleasure.

    Now seriously. Let’s all move on!

  98. Michael Goldman

    I am the first to support Dan in his cry of “Let’s move on!”, but I must first point out to Yoni that though it is indeed Daniel who keeps mentioning Yoni’s vegetables it is crystal clear that it is Yoni who has time and again incited him to do so.
    NOW LET’S REALLY MOVE ON!
    Does anybody know to where?

  99. “Yoni who has time and again incited him to do so”

    Mummy, he hit me back!

    You are an asshole.
    .

  100. Richard has a new post up

    that’s where to move on to

  101. Each demo, I parade in front of the antis holding up an Ahava product . It tends to induce a particularly strange effect in that they try to get close in order to snatch it away but then find themselves repelled by it .Reminds me of the Dracula movies where the vampires are repulsed by the sight of a crucifix . I managed to get a photo holding a bar of soap over the head of archtype As a Jew Bruce Levy . He was none to impressed

    • Lucky you. I’ve got 3 bags of Ahava stuff and they just calling me names and cry ‘Shame on you!’. How can you scared them off with a bar of soap.
      BTW, can you show that photo?

  102. Harvey

    More power to you for going to all the demos!

    I believe that in the escape from Acre Fortress escape the Jewish prisoners put bars of soap into socks and used them as a weapon to hit British soldiers with, on their heads. Try it out with Bruce and tell us what happens.

    PS
    You’ll need three socks altogether, two for your feet, one for the soap.

  103. Daniel Marks
    The soap was symbolic as a cleansing agent to clean these fascists from the streets . However it would take more then all the Ahava stocks to have any real effect .
    As for Jewish prisoners in the Acre prison , see if you can get hold of a copy of Exodous for a better understanding of what took place there.

  104. Well done, Harvey.
    And yes, I am sure the effect is bizarre. But then, who can fathom the antisemitic mind?
    DM will probably tell us to check in the Book of Job.

  105. Good idea Harvey, thanks.

    Strange how so many historians have overlooked Leon Uris’s fictional account of that period in doing their research. As a 10-year-old I read the book and saw the movie, I’m not certain in which order.

    If you wish to understand the operation, The Conquest of Acre Fortress
    http://cvcfineart.com/dynapage/IP1490.htm
    is the best book I can recommend. It is very old and has its faults. An amusing example is when its writer tells the reader what Dov Gruner was thinking in his last seconds before being hanged. However, I’ve found nothing better.

    All the best,

    Nothing wrong with Job, Yoni. However, with your documented Aramaic expertise, I’d imagine that the Book of Daniel is more up your alley.

  106. Michael Goldman

    Yoni
    I’m sorry for not asking sooner but in one of you postings you wrote
    “Mummy he hit me back”
    I know you’re only about 27 years old but even so this seems a strange thing to write.
    Could you please explain it’s meaning.

    • “I know you’re only about 27 years old ”
      Once again, you imagine that you ‘know’ something which is not remotely the case. So once again, eff off.

  107. Goldman,

    Why do not you run away from Isreal also like did Yoni?

    Yoni is the very good Jew. This is More important too be the good Jew then Zionist. Now he is might be back in Poland with fruits and vegetables from Isreal (75%). OK?

  108. “with your documented Aramaic expertise, I’d imagine that the Book of Daniel is more up your alley”

    Part 1 of the above demonstrates that you can’t read and understand a simple English statement.
    Part 2 demonstrates ignorance. Look up Job ch. 38.

  109. Piss off, Gamil. Neither I nor any member of my family has ever been to Poland.

  110. Michael Goldman

    Yeah ok
    But what was the “Mummy he hit me back” thing all about?
    By the way Yoni, don’t listen to to Gamil.
    I think he’s just trying to convince the rest of us to leave Israel.
    Don’t worry he will never succeed!

  111. Michael Goldman

    Gamil
    We are not cowards!
    We will not run away like Yoni!

  112. Yoni is a good man! Our struggel is needing very many Yoni’s! But he is eating to much Zionist fruit;

    Run away Zionists!! Run -run Goldman! Why is Poland not good?

    Regards,

    Gamil

    • Poland is not good, because Gamil hasn’t taken over the camel business there yet.

      Camels would like it there – Gamil go ahead have a look and bring light and development in the form of camel piss which cures all ills to the Poles, I am sure they’ll treat you like hero there.

  113. Yoni is not a cowards. He is a good man but not 27! (:

  114. Oh, dear.
    Goldman: your fantasy that I was ‘inciting’ DM to stalk me is akin to someone whining that his victim hit him back.