Gideon Levy packs them in at Amnesty



I went to hear Gideon Levy talk at Amnesty in London last night. He’s in the UK to promote his book The Punishment of Gaza and last night he was in conversation with John Snow (Snow presents Channel 4’s Seven O’clock news and seems fond of chairing anti-Israel events).

It was nice to be actually let in unlike my last attempt. This event was co-presented by Palestine Solidarity Campaign and Jews for Justice for Palestinians, the latter organisation being more open to dialogue than some might give credit.

I hope being barred from a public debate on Israel/Palestine because people don’t like what I write won’t become de rigeur, but you never know.

Back to Levy. From what I had read about this tour I was expecting the devil incarnate to walk into the packed auditorium breathing fire from its nostrils. It didn’t happen.

Maybe in my old age I am becoming desensitised to the ubiquitous unsubstantiated accusations of racism and apartheid that are made, like they were last night, against Israel that they don’t anger me anymore.

Maybe I was softened up by Levy’s claim that he is an Israeli patriot: “All I do is care about Israel. I’ve used my journalistic career for a better Israel, not against Israel. I love Gaza but have not been alowed to go there since December 2006. I asked Ehud Barak why Israeli journalists are not allowed in Gaza and he said he didn’t know they weren’t allowed in.”

Levy saw Operation Cast Lead (OCL) not as a war but as a brutal operation against a civilian population.

He thinks OCL was the turning point of world public opinion which is now “less tolerant of Israeli violence and aggression. Look at the flotilla. We now do what we want wherever we want, for example in international waters, with force as the first option. The Israeli general in charge of the flotilla operation has said that next time we will use snipers.”

(Levy obviously hadn’t seen the BBC’s Death in the Med in which Jane Corbin concluded that that the Mavi Marmara’s bid to break the naval blockade wasn’t really about bringing aid to Gaza but it was a political move designed by the Islamist organisation IHH and others to put pressure on Israel and the international community. Corbin had just reported that two thirds of the medicines being transported to the people of Gaza by the flotilla were out of date and useless.)

He paid tribute to the fact that Israel was always the first on the scene to help in international crises like in Mexico, Turkey and Haiti.

“There have been worse occupations in history but not where the occupier felt so good about itself. We are the first occupiers in the world to say that we are the victim and Israelis believe the IDF is the most moral army in the world, ” he said.

He asked: “How can an occupation by a democratic society last for 42 years? How do Israelis live with it?”

He answered: “We were trained to think we are very moral but that Palestinians were not human beings like us. Dehumanisation is the only tool which enables us to maintain the occupation and feel good about ourselves. It is wall-to-wall now. Even the peaceniks don’t feel the Palestinians are human beings”.

He told us how two Israeli dogs being killed during OCL garnered more media coverage than the deaths of hundreds of Palestinians. The dogs’ funerals and interviews with the owners were all over the front pages while Palestinian deaths were only mentioned on pages 15 and 16: “In Israel two Israeli dogs are worth more than hundreds of Palestinians,” he concluded.

(Had Levy picked up a British newspaper recently or logged on to the internet he would see that while people are dying in Pakistan from the terrible floods we are obsessed by a woman who dumped a cat in a bin.)

Levy said that a crowd of the size at Amnesty to hear him would never turn out in Tel Aviv and that Haaretz, the newspaper he writes for, is an island with a small readership.

He spoke of the ever growing file labelled “Subscription cancellations due to Gideon Levy”: “I get full freedom to write for Haaretz but Haaretz is losing influence,” he said.

He recalled the 400,000 Israelis who protested after the 1982 Sabra and Shatilla massacres which, he said, were not even carried out by the Israelis but thought that that size protest would not occur now. He has been described as a “self-hating Jew” and “an enemy of Israel”.

(When Shlomo Sand came to the UK to promote his anti-Zionist polemic, The Invention of the Jewish People, he said it was top of the best-seller list in Israel.

As for Haaretz itself it is read nationally and internationally. It is published in English and Hebrew and is distributed along with the International Herald Tribune and has a daily circulation of 72,000 (100,000 at weekends). The Jerusalem Post’s circulation is 15,000 (40,000 at weekends).)

On the question of boycotting Israel Levy said that although he cannot call for a boycott himself, because he is Israeli, it is a legitimate weapon especially as Israeli uses it against Gaza, Hamas and Iran.

He was asked whether boycotts are racist because they target Jewish Israelis, even those opposed to the settlements. He failed to address this question properly but he did say that boycotters should read the label first and boycott only if a product is from the West Bank.

(Obviously, Levy fails to understand the racism inherent in the boycott Israel movement because first, boycotters don’t look at the label in such a discriminating manner. As long as the label says “Israel”, they will boycott (One member of the audience claimed that the only reason they boycott is because the Palestinians themselves are calling for it). And, second, the boycott includes Israeli academics.)

Levy’s main complaint is that he feels so alone in Israel. He feels the drama is all going on in Israel’s backyard and yet there is no one covering it. He said there is no censorship in Israel, only self-censorship by journalists.

(But even if this were the case there are plenty of foreign journalists in Gaza, including from the BBC. But I can fully understand why Israeli journalists would be so banned; they would be an easy target for kidnapping by Hamas.)

Despite all the above Levy is not actually an anti-Zionist.

He called for the return of Palestinians to a Palestinian state and a limited return of some 500,000 to Israel including an admission of liability from Israel for what happened in 1948 and compensation for the non-returning refugees.

“What happened in 1948 is an historic injustice but it happens in wars. Israel is a fait accomplit so let’s move to a new chapter. The Jews had a right to settle in Palestine but the Palestinian rejection of the partition plan should not have led to the expulsion of 650,000 from their villages,” he said.

Levy claims that no one in Israel cares about the Palestinians and he cites Tel Aviv as the best example of this. But then again he would hear the same complaints from the residents of Sderot who also think that the rest of Israel doesn’t care about the bombs that are regularly fired at them from Gaza.

I had a couple of nice chats afterwards and one with someone in charge of the Northern Section of the TUC who said that a full TUC boycott of Israel is coming.

I asked whether the TUC had ever considered a boycott of Britain or America due to NATO forces occupying Afghanistan.

He said it was impossible to boycott Britain but there is every possibility of a boycott of America being passed. I’d like to see them try!

Keep an eye on the TUC Conference, 13th-16th September.

117 responses to “Gideon Levy packs them in at Amnesty

  1. first and foremost thanks for a wonderful write-up of a sad event (I’ll be eternally grateful to ghastly Gert, that he led me to your blog)

    Levy’s main complaint is that he feels so alone in Israel.

    should we tell Mr. Levy that there is a guy in Bridlington desperate for some company?

    or will this piece of news sooth his pain?

    Major D. is the first woman in the IDF to fly a F-16I jet.

  2. ooops forgot to subscribe

  3. I subscribe to Haaretz because it is a much better read than the Post. Gideon Levy writes especially well, even if I usually don’t agree with his views. Anyway, he’s agreed to meet me, so I look forward to finding out what makes the man tick . . .

  4. Well, well, well. A rather well measured piece by Richard Millett. Some of the analogies really don’t fly but some kudos nonetheless…

  5. Levy was on Jeera’s Riz Kahn yesterday too. Very interesting but nothing new to me…

  6. Gert
    just in case you are still on this threat I have a serious question.

    Once upon a time you said that you were a geek and proud of it. As you know I don’t believe many things you say, but that was one of the few which I fully believed.
    Then the other day you all of a sudden claimed that you know nothing but HTML tags. That doesn’t synch at all with the guys I have known who had a geeky reputation, I mean a serious, respected by their co-professionals, geeky reputation.

    Now I seem to remember something else i.e. that besides the two chemical enterprises you had, you also once IT-ed it professionally. I forgot whether it was between your two chemical companies or after them, but I am pretty sure that it was before that Pakistan interview. I must have the info somewhere but before I search my mess I thought I make you an offer for a cease fire and ask you with “open visor”.

    The reason I ask is because I don’t understand that if the above is correct why do you belittle yourself in the one field where I had some genuine respect for you?

  7. Slike:

    Keep fishing, dear!

    Geekdom is elastic.

  8. But Gert
    you are presumably commenting here under your real name as an identifiable person and besides the fact that one day your business partner or your wife or your daughter may stumble on your popsicle rants there remains the fact that you soil on top of it all a true expertise you seem to have. Why?

    Are you now a lapsed chemist via lapsed IT-whatever artist? Is maybe this whole act you are showing here a kind of performance? Will you expose us all one day on a big screen in London so the world can marvel about what adults spend their time on?

    really I can only an artist imagine as somebody who doesn’t mind to expose himself the way you do.

    BTW if you were a more trustworthy guy that rubber company of yours sounds as if we two might find out that we have had at some time common acquaintances.

    What happened to that job? you must have been about 35 when that appointment was published and that doesn’t look like self-employed on the other hand you sounded like you were telling the truth to that Pakistani outfit with your two own companies.

    You said Gert Meyers was a rare name – look here what a story Google has found, I hope that wasn’t you or any relation of yours? Sorry to be so nosy but maybe you feel better when you think of what happened to Bluebeard’s wifes 😉

    Mrs Anna Meyers, the wife of beaten farm labourer Mr Gert
    Meyers, had testified the three accused had taken Mr Muggels
    from a bakkie into the barn and she had heard his screams for
    help before the three accused had emerged carrying his
    bloodied body.

  9. Before you know it we’ll have 200 + comments like this from Silke alone. Tried and tested method. See over at Hasbara Buster.

    I rest my case…

  10. There was another full house for a rerun at the Frontline Club in Paddington this evening.
    I asked a question about the 0/1/2 State Solution;
    GL maintains that the present position is effectively a 1 State;
    for 2 state the issues of the settlements and addressing Israeli security concerns remain.
    A parallel was drawn with removing 1,000,000 pieds noirs from Algeria.

    • thanks Richard

      I moved to Paris at the same time when it got flooded by the “pieds noirs” – the best hotel room the company could provide me with was one where you had to put the chair on the bed if you wanted to open the door, that’s how crowded the city was …

      these parallel drawers are illusionists every one of them

  11. Now this is really unjust of you Gert

    for once I am being serious with you taking you up on your offer to have an adult conversation and you accuse me of doing my Hasbara Buster thingy again. I don’t do the same thing twice, it would bore me too much.

    and to prove my earnestness to you, did you come into contact with the fogging nuisance at your rubber outfit at the time? It seems to be under control now but back then I think it was still alive and kicking.

    How long did you stay with them? Did you ever work with Volkswagen or any of the other big ones?

    Did you pick up your IT expertise while working for them? One can pick up a lot in – how long was it – 7 years?

    My outfit had a fabulous IT-Department but I was always only interested in picking up what I needed from day to day for MY job but I genuinely admired the guys who kept my place operative.

    Isn’t that South African story terrible? I hope that they aren’t relatives no matter how remote.

  12. Interesting report on Levy. I think he needs to get out of his Tel Aviv bubble. When I was in Israel this summer I was heartened by a reemergence of the Israeli peace movement in Jerusalem. It’s not all that many people but it is new folks, not the same old campaigners.

  13. Jonathan Hoffman

    The reason no-one goes to hear Levy in Israel is that his credibility was shot through years ago

  14. Leonie Lachmish

    “(Had Levy picked up a British newspaper recently or logged on to the internet he would see that while people are dying in Pakistan from the terrible floods we are obsessed by a woman who dumped a cat in a bin.)”
    Just what I was thinking, Richard! I happened to see Sky News at a few different times earlier this week and that was the item being covered again and again. Maybe they’ll find one Palestinian amongst the 20 million impoverished, homeless Pakistanis and leave the cat alone.

  15. Rebecca
    It’s not all that many people but it is new folks, not the same old campaigners.

    was it by chance one of these new folks who made you misread Yaacov’s post on Jerusalem city planning from August 20 so head-scratchingly weird only now?

    You are teaching at a university, shouldn’t you of all people know how to read?

    I keep my personal little guess who inspired you to frame your question so very weirdly to myself but I will be watching mildly amused whether it’ll turn out that I am right and somebody has turned to operating by proxy.

  16. (Had Levy picked up a British newspaper recently or logged on to the internet he would see that while people are dying in Pakistan from the terrible floods we are obsessed by a woman who dumped a cat in a bin.)

    We??? Speak for yourself, the cat people are a noisy minority to which I don’t belong. There will always be a market for petty ‘scandals’ where the completely apolitical want to get ‘involved’. It proves very little either way.

    Levy claims that no one in Israel cares about the Palestinians and he cites Tel Aviv as the best example of this. But then again he would hear the same complaints from the residents of Sderot who also think that the rest of Israel doesn’t care about the bombs that are regularly fired at them from Gaza.

    Blimey, ungrateful brats in Sderot, aren’t they? Not only have they been provided with bomb shelters, but simply put, during OCL about 1,400 Palestinians were killed in their honour! If that’s not a pledge of undying love then I don’t know what is!

  17. Gert
    I am very sorry to notice once again that you argue as if the ability to put yourself into other people’s shoes were completely foreign to you. Knowing you the way I do by now this lack of compassion and judgment somehow doesn’t fit.

    Since you keep monitoring this thread here’s what I have been asking myself:

    did Gert maybe set up that GM-net-thingy in the hope of attracting customers by siding with an especially outlandish opinion i.e. with people who nobody who has a reputation to lose will touch with a barge pole? Kind of thinking soul brothers will be more willing to do business with me …

    (no I will not publish all the info I found starting at May 26 because no matter what you think of me I abide by self-imposed limits)

    but in all honesty I am baffled by what made you decide to become such a strange mixture of genuine willingness to give others a helping hand and popsicle style rantings.
    And why for crying out loud did you say you knew only HTML-tags when everything else I stumble upon speaks of much greater ambition (and ability) and no matter your shortages I have noticed in certain fields I strongly believe that when it comes to netpertise that there is some ground to your claims.

    BTW I have put a quote on Speaker’s Corner which has been aptly renamed Trash Talk that may be helpful in giving you new ideas for variations of popsicle talk.

    and here is the link for everybody else about an, I think, worth a read piece by Jeffrey Herf

  18. Silke:


    Can you explain why your obnoxious forebears that ran IG Farben, today basically Bayer, still today call their synthetic elastomer (that’s ‘rubber’ to you) range ‘BuNa’ (from Butyl Natrium), after the obsolete elastomer they once attempted to produce at the infamous BuNa works (basically a slave outfit)? Is it just lack of taste or plain stupidity? Or the arrogance you are so famed for?

  19. Gideon Levy’s weekly column in Ha’aretz Magazine is aptly titled “Twilight Zone.” At times, his reports have little or no connection to reality but are written to support his agenda.Please do not be taken in by this man’s suave and engaging style. The presentation may be slick but the content is usually lacking in both truth and accuracy.

  20. Levy is saying Israel is the most evil state in the world, that Israeli Jews are, in some sense, the most evil people in history, even. They may not do the most evil things, but they enjoy doing that evil more than anyone else.

    Well, he has assured his sainthood, among Israel’s enemies.

    Do you suppose he will ever cash it in, as did Ilan Pappe?

  21. Gert
    funny how memory works I had always associated mainly BASF with IG Farben (besides Bayer and now gone under Hoechst and some others).

    But how about getting you a bit more into feverishly yelping state?

    what do you think of Degussa (Deutsche Gold- und Silberscheideanstalt) keeping its name after the war (I think it has now gone under) which was not only “famous” for the subsidiary which was into “supplying” gas but also for “recycling” gold (scheiden in that context means separate). Still the company was allowed to coat the columns of the Berlin Holocaust memorial with one of their products (for free of course).

    Wherever you dig wherever you want in German history, economy or society you come across stories like these and nothing what you can come up with I can’t top with greater horror due to the fact that I wanted to know as much as possible what the people did that I belong to.

    Still since you brought it up it made me remember that there is an open question as to “toiling” and thus what made you stop “toiling” at that IT-company of yours already in 2003? and have you really forgotten so much about it all that now only HTML tags is all you remember? Sorry to be snarky again, if you want to we can revert any moment to non-snarky “open visor” mode – right now it is still up to you.

    Did it become a failure because you treated one of your customers to one of your popsicle style rants and they found that they’d rather not get close to somebody so close to losing it point?

    And why are such names like Buna kept alive? Most likely because they are worth a lot of money, ask any intellectual property expert specialising in brands or whatever it is called in Anglo these days.

  22. Silke:

    My IT company was a broker company. It didn’t produce anything. It bought and sold.

    You’re going to ruin this thread again for no reason other than your narcissism. As with all obsessives, your posts are getting longer and longer again…

    Sure infamous Popsicle didn’t have anything to do with the infamous Buna works? Or hubby? As a Jewish overseer perhaps?

  23. Gert
    so to summarize your claimed geekdom – you only know HTML tags and were a computer related shop – that brokers buy and sell is news to me – in my country they facilitate seller and buyer meeting and claim to advise both on how to get the ideal deal. But isn’t then “Other computer related activities” a bit vague to describe it.
    Oh and as to narcisstic I never really understood what that term meant, but that’s because a lot of that Freudian stuff eludes me and Robert Graves claims that the story of Narziss doesn’t qualify as a myth but probably has been inserted for educational purposes. In any case I am not into kissing or embracing or anything else myself, not even on real mirrors it spoils the view and the pleasure I derive from smiling at myself.

    As you claimed earlier that my husband must be a Zionist i.e. Jewish I find your reference to overseers especially “sensitive”. You never learn where the limit is, amazing but then geekery is all about condensing everything into 1 and 0. But by applying it to popsicles and much much much worse you really supply again and again the reasons for why nobody wants to play with you.

    BTW don’t the possibilities of Google Earth frighten you? or have you moved in the meantime so that doesn’t concern you? Seeing how easy peaking at people’s privacy is these days it sure frightened me senseless.

  24. now that you mention it Gert –
    my father actually was into chemistry though nowhere even remotely close to rubber to the best of my knowledge and not on your arcane level but enough so he could cook floor wax and soap in our kitchen until the kitchen almost went up in flames and then peddled the stuff on trips to the country to exchange it for something to eat. Besides that he also held a day-job,
    even though his disability certificate said 100 %.

    Now I look forward to another bout of your insane screaming

  25. As you claimed earlier that my husband must be a Zionist i.e. Jewish I find your reference to overseers especially “sensitive”.>/blockquote>

    Good. Two can play that game. You push? I push back but harder. Simples really… There’s more where it came from.

  26. As you claimed earlier that my husband must be a Zionist i.e. Jewish I find your reference to overseers especially “sensitive”.

    Good. Two can play that game. You push? I push back but harder. Simples really… There’s more where it came from.

  27. Gert
    you really don’t see the difference?
    did I ever complain in this way about your popsicle rants?
    I didn’t and I never would have, not if you had come up with some really tough stuff
    but there is a red line even for that kind of stuff and you don’t know where it is, a non-Jew mocking a Jew on overseer-something means you have crossed a red line
    and you wonder why I keep saying that you aren’t fit for polite company.

    but lets not get away from your geekery brokering outfit – what went wrong?
    and what went wrong at that company where you got that grand title in 1997?
    and while we are at it, what else went wrong?
    when where those two chemics outfits going wrong.
    and is all this failure after failure the reason why you are out to smear the one people on earth where in our wherabouts nothing has ever been heard of them liking to wield baseball bats outside the sports arena.
    and now pause for a moment and think how I might call a man who choses his opponent for such a reason.

  28. People like you are very predictable. They and only they can dish it but they can’t take it.

    You are however rather typical of the German sample I’ve had to endure in life: haughty, arrogant, full of petty criticism and prejudice. Vindictive and slightly supremacist. Polite conversation for you is only possible when you’re among equally bigoted airheads.

    Regarding red lines, you’ve crossed dozens of my red lines and other people’s red lines and they don’t matter to you. Give me one good reason why I should respect yours?

    This isn’t ‘polite society’, this is a Zionist blog where the owner can’t be bothered enforcing his own comment policy. And Zionism does occasionally remind me of polite Nazism: there too things were ‘discussed’ at a backdrop of murder, ethnic cleansing, expropriation of innocent people’s property and racist discrimination.

    If there’s one reason to despise your husband, whether he’s Jewish or not (not sure I believe you), is that he married a piece of crapola like you.

  29. psst Gert don’t tell anybody but I am a polyandrist …

    knowing you the way I do I’d recommend it to your wife also but not to give you any wrong ideas, none of my husbands is an unimaginative bitter ranter like you. Actually that all of them are so perfectly polite, imaginative and wonderful lovers to boot is the reason why I couldn’t say no to any of them.

    Other than that you are still miles away from crossing MY red line – after our long and intimate relationship you seem not even to have the vaguest idea where it might be while I feel pretty sure lots of others on this blog have figured it out long long ago. i.e. I seem to be predictable to everybody around here except to you.

    talking about the victims of my ancestors’ massacres the way you do doesn’t cross MY red line it crosses the red line of ALL decent people who ever heard the story. And that you obviously don’t get the difference baffles me more than anything else about you. I have never credited the story that people exist who are incapable of compassion but the more I read you the more I doubt my disbelief.

    Anyway much more interesting to me is that my highly disabled father keeping mother and me and his mistresses (yeah it runs in the family) in food and shelter through cooking floor wax and soap and wheeling and dealing in the countryside doesn’t inspire you to do any ranting? I would have thought better of you – instead you whine like the last sissy on earth about evil Germans .

    and btw did it ever occur to you that I am trying to sour you to Richard’s comment thread so we can start delighting eachother with poems again? If I succeed don’t you think that would be a much more elegant way than censoring could ever be?

  30. I somehow get the feeling that Silke and Gert are one and the same schizophrenic person otherwise please why these posts descend into ad hominem attacks having little ornothing to do with the topic in hand.

  31. Nachman
    why don’t you then get back on topic and give Gert another chance for another one like this from 1:19

    Blimey, ungrateful brats in Sderot, aren’t they? Not only have they been provided with bomb shelters, but simply put, during OCL about 1,400 Palestinians were killed in their honour! If that’s not a pledge of undying love then I don’t know what is!

    I have watched lots of people trying to slug it out with the Gerts of this world using rational arguments, all it came to in the end was there getting another chance and another chance to spout their dirt.
    At least my nonsensical approach keeps him largely out of this kind of “mischief”.

    so go ahead try your hand, have with him what he calls a “serious discussion” with an “open visor” – nothing will make him happier

  32. Silke, I have no idea what you’re talking about. As far as I know, there’s no one who has bothered to impersonate me on the internets (why would they?).

    And Silke, perhaps you and Gert should argue with each other via email instead of other people’s blogs?

  33. Rebecca
    I never said that anybody else impersonated you on the net

    it was yours truly commenting here and at Yaacov’s.

    and thanks for confirming that I guessed right that you think you are good at misrepresenting other people’s writing with the intent to smear them.

    as to Gert in case you haven’t noticed, I refuse on principle to argue with him on his terms.
    If you are so taken by him, why don’t you start a one on one with him or even better comment on his “excellent” copy and paste blog. I am sure he’d welcome you. Guessing from the little I’ve seen from you, you might even agree with a lot he has to say.

  34. We actually didn’t cancel our subscription to Haaretz, after being faithful readers for 15 years, because of Gideon Levy. I mean, you don’t have to read the guy. Anyway, even if you do, you soon realize how repetitive he is and he gets tedious to read pretty quickly. Nor because of Amira Hass. Is she still around? (These really are names from the past for me. Haven’t seen them, heard of them or read anything by them for at least seven or eight years.)

    The problem with Haaretz was that their bias started getting seriously in the way of real reportage. Our last straw, back in 2002 or 2003, was an article about the migrant workers in Israel and their inexplicable and illogcal support of Israeli government policies at the time (taking action against Palestinian terrorism back when human bombs were blowing up women and children in Israeli cities daily). The writer of this supposedly in-depth article came up with all sorts of weird and wonderful anthropological explanations for this strange phenomenon. All manner of creative theories were suggested. But not once was the ordinary commonsense reason offered. Not once was it suggested that they were no different from anyone else in Israel back then – just plain grateful that the government was at long last taking steps to defend them from murderous terrorists and finally bringing some safety and order back into their lives. And they were siding with Israel and not with the murderous terrorists simply because they understood what to the writer was unimaginable – Israel was RIGHT.

    How can you read a crazy newspaper that doesn’t call a writer on something like that?

  35. From Richard Millett’s detailed description of the Levy interview, it seems that Levy repeated most if not all of the points he made in a book promotion talk to Scots supporters of the Palestinians on August 19.
    Those who wish to see and hear Levy’s talk can do so at the link listed below.
    He comes across as a mild mannered pessimistic sort of man, though in his articles and on some Israeli TV discussions, he is much less laid back and very often vehement and aggressive in his arguments. In my opinion this lack of moderation and tendency to over-exaggeration has greatly reduced his ability to influence the majority of Israelis who are intensely dissatisfied with the failure to end the occupation. Associating with some of Israel’s declared enemies will not help, either.

  36. Blacklisted Dictator

    It is about time that Israel boycotted The UK (a sinking Islamist ship).

    Gideon Levy is a flying intellectual.

    Paul Berman: “We look at ourselves in the Western countries and we say that, if we are rich, relatively speaking, as a society, it is because we have plundered our wealth from other people. Our wealth is a sign of our guilt. If we are powerful, compared with the rest of the world, it is because we treat people in other parts of the world in oppressive and morally objectionable ways. Our privileged position in the world is actually a sign of how racist we are and how imperialistic and exploitative we are. All the wonderful successes of our society are actually the signs of how morally inferior we are, and we have much to regret and feel guilty about. So when we look at the world, we should look at it in a spirit of humility and remorse, and we should recognize that other people have been unfairly treated.

    We should recognize the superiority of those other people over ourselves. Money-wise, we may be richer. But, morally, the other people are richer. And so, we should despise ourselves, and we should love the other people — the people who possess qualities so superior to our own as barely to be human. And then, filled with those very peculiar ideas, we set about looking for messianic figures who might express the superior culture of the other people, and might lead the human race to a higher stage of development. And if someone objects to this analysis, we say, oh, we inferior Westerners are incapable of understanding the mysterious thought-patterns of those other people, so who are you to judge?”

  37. Blacklisted Dictator

    Jon Snow presenting The Gideon Levy Show,
    Makes me want to throw

  38. Blacklisted Dictator

    There is uproar over the Israel embassy’s role in promoting Gideon Levy:

  39. Blacklisted Dictator

    I note that Jeremy Bowen (BBC) is also presenting Gideon Levy.

    Since the tour is under the aegis of the Palestinian Solidarity Committe,
    one wonders, once again, about the impartiality of Channel 4 and The BBC.

    I attach the following:
    Wednesday 18 August, Edinburgh, St Georges West, Shandwick Pl, 7.30pm (Scottish Palestine Solidarity Campaign open meeting).

    Thursday 19 August, Manchester, Friends Meeting House, 7.00pm (Manchester Palestine Solidarity Campaign open meeting).

    Wednesday 25 August, London, Frontline Club, 7.00pm (in conversation with Jeremy Bowen).

  40. Blacklisted Dictator

    Jeremy Bowen from The BBC,
    Conversing with Gideon Levy,
    Organized by The PSC!
    What about media impartiality?

  41. What about media impartiality?

    one wonders, once again, about the impartiality of Channel 4 and The BBC.

    And higher up:

    It is about time that Israel boycotted The UK (a sinking Islamist ship).

    Blacklisted Dictator complaining about media bias is a bit risible when he nails his colours to his Islamophobic mast so clearly. If I recall well, BD is one of the many ‘Clash of Civilisation’ types that have infested Harry’s Place…

  42. Gert
    I don’t like the way you express your disapproval at 1:24 pm

    I’ve been through your first month of blog postings ever, a bit repetitive but otherwise quite enlightening.

  43. Silke, are you glued to your monitor, waiting for signs of life of your beloved? Every time I comment here, you ‘respond’ within minutes!

  44. yes Gert I’ve noticed that also (long long ago), it seems that our daily routines sync perfectly, no wonder we take such delight in eachother’s company.
    melchettmike has a new post up – very much recommended by me – you are rewarded with a link

  45. The Belcher’s obsessions with me and other critics of Zion doesn’t interest me in the slightest…

  46. is that why you came on here within the blink of an eyer after melchettmike had the piece about you online?
    Gert come clean and as a first step I’advise you to abstain from your ridiculous nickname creations.

  47. Tut tut, punctuation, dear!

    is that why you came on here within the blink of an eyer after melchettmike had the piece about you online?

    You don’t seriously believe I actually read or follow The Belcher’s belches, do you?

    Belchy claims he’s ‘popular’: I believe him; there’s always a market for chest beating trash.

    If you’re referring to the ‘piece’ he dedicated entirely to me, he wrote that after he bumped into me at this blog. The time line is very clear. Afterwards I discovered his anti-French screed and put it through the Jew test: it failed miserably…

  48. Gert
    your “Jew test” was about the most lousy piece of writing I’ve ever come across and please note that I refrain from commenting on how it exposed you as a thinker.

    But talking about exposure and knowing your yearning for “open visor” “serious discussions” I recommend this blog to you:

    I have come across the man recently on another blog and I have an inkling that you may hit it off together.
    To me he seems more in the “intellectual” category of Fraudster Ibrahim than your adored Jews sans Frontières which I find a bit on the crude side to be honest. And knowing you the way I do I think the high falutin’ stuff is more suitable for your. Also Donny wants to improve his English and thus may be digging your giving him a leg-up.

  49. Gert, you are a moron.


  50. Silke:

    your “Jew test” was about the most lousy piece of writing I’ve ever come across and please note that I refrain from commenting on how it exposed you as a thinker.

    Blame the author, not the spoofer of the author. I didn’t write anything. All I did was replace ‘French’ with ‘Jew’ or ‘Jewish’, in The Belcher’s shameful rant. Those who disagree with that are in agreement with ‘Jewish exceptionalism’ or are plain old semitophiles. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander.

    The Belcher is one of those imbeciles who’ll scream blue murder at someone like me for being in favour of Palestinian statehood, or even for ‘insulting’ one single Israeli politician, yet reserves the right to be deeply racist about the French (he admits hating them). He can’t see the hypocrisy, presumably because in The Belcher’s mind antisemitism has to be elevated to the ‘Special Racism’. This is an attitude that is deeply common among Jewish Zionists and their often even more radical non-Jewish counter parts.

    Belchy and his clique don’t seem to be too keen on homosexuals either. I daren’t think what their attitude to Muslims/Arabs are, although his tacit approval (and Dannenbaum’s) of the EDL could lead to much speculation…

    That you didn’t get it says a lot about you…

    You keep your cards close to your chest bet will eventually also come clean about your racist attitudes. Your confirmation of Belchy’s gallicphobia is but a hint…

  51. Adam, you suck.

  52. I would actually challenge Belchy to try and get his Francophobic musings published even in the worst of Britain’s racist gutter press: even the Daily Hate Mail wouldn’t touch it with a barge pole and probably denounce him.

  53. Gert, you suck
    melchettmike is very good at making me LOL and I especially enjoyed his “francophob” piece – it was exactly the kind of banter we “Europeans” enjoy so very much whenever we dine multinationally – if that is racism for you, so be it and I’ll happily confess to being exceedingly racist.
    BTW the Belgians the Flemish included were as good at banter as the rest of us. Is lacking that gift what makes you so bitter, so immature, so childish, so boring albeit in a funny way. Is the constant realisation that you are too slow in the head for it really such a big pain that it keeps you from enjoying life.

    Anyway let me add about my recommendation of Donny’s blog
    he is getting a bit riled from my banter and so you will find a soulmate in him. Also he is a no-free-speech-blog so you must in no way be scared of my showing up there.
    For once Gert I am being really honestly nice with you, you want a playmate and I have found you one and mind you, not a trashy one but a rather high-class one as these guys go.
    i.e. bugger off

  54. i.e. bugger off

    ‘Ladies first’ and ‘age before beauty’, spring to mind…

    Belchy admits to hating the French. No banter. Middle aged British men often do.

    You’re a child, easily amused by ‘banter’, as long as it doesn’t get under your skin, of course…

  55. The people who would have thought my ‘Jew test’ spoof on Belchy’s anti-French screed was funny are antisemites. The people who find Belchy’s anti-French screed funny are francophobes.

    The ‘Europeans’ that like to indulge in anti-whatever ‘banter’ are primitive imbeciles, banter or not. Always borne out of ignorance and past stereotypes…

  56. Gert
    pray, when have you ever managed to get under my skin
    and you certainly tried
    Melchettmike admits to hating French, I admit to hating Bavarians
    other than on average all Europeans are extremely badly behaved towards service personnel in sharp contrast to North-Americans and Canadians. All of them can’t resist doing a bit of Lording once they have paid for a service
    and whoever he really feels with all that Gert and Gideon-Levy-drearyness that he/she’d like a good laugh, here is a link to humour-tefloned Gert’s “evidence”


  57. There’s nothing wrong with my sense of humour, dear. But we can’t all laugh at the same things. You may find ‘pimply people’ funny, to me that’s sniggering behind the bike shed. Much of what you seem to find ‘funny’ I simply find distasteful and puerile.

    As regards getting under your skin, surely you don’t want me to continue the Popsicle sage? Or your implication you are related to a Roma? That Daddy was a mere draftee?

  58. Gert
    you may continue anything you want, your popsicle rants actually had a certain charm – the charm of the off the rocker villain in certain movies
    BTW my father wasn’t only good at cooking soap and floor wax he was also successful at wheeling and dealing, all besides his regular job. Quite an accomplishment compared to a fluent in 4 languages, university educated chemist and proud of it geek, don’t you think so?

    why can’t I get you interested in Donny? I swear you will find a lot more satisfaction whining duets with him than muscle Joe can ever give you. Or are you scared that he might be a genuine global player and your manners not quite up to his standards?

    this really doesn’t appeal to you? or are you just a bit shy? or the coward I guess you are?

    World travelled, experienced in all the good, bad and ugly in life.
    Admittingly has a low tolerance for ignorants, arrogance and those that push a radical agenda

  59. Why on Earth should I go where you tell me to go? Give me one good, genuine reason…

  60. because believe it or not I honestly expect that it may make you feel better

    since you won’t believe me having any friendly feelings, here are some other reasons:
    I want you out of here without my having to humiliate you even more than I have already done and that inhibition overcame me because
    I felt compassion when I went to Google street view
    also I am not a hater, I am totally indifferent to you the moment you either behave or stop showing up here.

    As to Donny please keep in mind that I am not quite sure whether he is grandstanding or really the global operator he claims to be, but if it were as true as he claims it is, he might even become a useful business connection – you know better than most how good I am at getting at people so you should be able to connect there. But be careful, even though Donny can be quite vulgar he seems at the same time into presenting himself as a man of refined manners. Therefore my advice would be to tiptoe in.

  61. also I am not a hater, I am totally indifferent to you the moment you either behave or stop showing up here.

    Alas for your position it isn’t you who can make me go or stay…

  62. I am very pleased to hear that, in Levy’s own words, Haaretz “is an island with a small readership”. If you want to know, check out:

  63. Edgar
    I’ve finally read my first Gideon Levy column ever
    overall impression he tries (way too) hard to come across as a person of higher “culture”

    the column was about the theatre “drama” and made me stumble on at least 2 things
    why does Levy believe that Brecht would be aghast at his Caucasian Circle being performed in Ariel. Germans are forever complaining about the nooses Brecht’s heirs put around anybody’s neck with what they consider keeping him clean. So probability has it for me that they have checked and come to the conclusion that they and by implication Brecht is OK with the piece being performed in a “settlement”.
    I find the choice of the Caucasian Circle for a “settlement” a bit impolite, after all the piece is about proving your love by letting go (at least that’s how I understood it decades ago) and then after you have let go you will be rewarded by Mr. Big with gaining legitimate possession. In my book that makes for a nice theatre evening but is rather not in synch with my everyday experiences, so what is it what the artists will be trying to teach settlers by chosing that piece (Brecht was a lot about teaching/bettering etc people and yes he took the story from Salomon, but who is the one able to wield Salomon’s powers today? and if there were, would we like that?)

  64. I’ve finally read my first Gideon Levy column ever
    overall impression he tries (way too) hard to come across as a person of higher “culture”

    The High Priestess of Knownothingism squeals. It’s because you have an entirely undeserved sophisticated self-image that you believe others must also try and ‘come across as a person of higher “culture”’. It’s classic kvetch, in other words…

    And you’ve never read anything by one of Israel’s leading critics of contemporary Zionism up to now? Blind me with a fish fork!

  65. Gert, you are a moron.

  66. Adam, you SUCK

  67. Adam
    after thinking long and carefully about your last, after even doing an adapted to my present life peripato on it I have come to the enlightened conclusion that I support your motion at 3:25 without reservation i.e. you may count on my support unquestioningly

    PS: ain’t it funny that one grandstander (Angeber/intellektueller Hochstapler) can’t recognize another one for what he is?

  68. i.e. you may count on my support unquestioningly

    Very Naziesque, indeed. A sluggish response from a slug. Worse than a thug…

  69. Gert
    first of all other than you I recognize a fraud when he is frauding, remember our common darling Alberto? and Gideon Levy posing as a connoisseur of Brecht is a fraud.

    and this is my good-bye gift for today to you
    it’s a series, my favourite todate is the snapping turtle, mother nature is amazing.
    And here is my peace offer of the day
    Arab Nationalism and the Poisoned Palestinian Chalice
    amazing that you still haven’t commented at Donny’s – could it be that Donny seems too knowledgeable for a student of Gideon Levy to dare to chime in there?
    I’ve always considered you to be a coward, but such a coward – you amaze me!

  70. Daniel Marks

    A recent Gert contribution to discussion regarding Gideon Levy’s lecture at Amnesty:

    “Adam, you SUCK…”

    A well researched and enlightening comment.

  71. Dannenbaum:

    Researched, no. Borne out of experience, yes. Empirical rather than enlightened.

  72. An Open Letter to Gert,

    As you must have noted in recent months, Daniel Marks’s writings have become as prolific as they have perceptive.

    It pains me to admit to having become overshadowed by his profundity, dwarfed by his insights, and humbled by his humor. The only thing I have going for me at the moment is the fact that you saw fit to dedicate a piece about me on your fine and excellent blog – (grovel grovel) and chose to retract on your promise to give Daniel his own dedicated page.

    Do me a favor, me old mucker, (lick lick). I urge you to continue to deny and exclude DM. Do not capitulate by giving him that highly sought-after piece. I know that Daniel is gagging for it, and his yearning is the only relative advantage I have over him at the moment.

    Surely you and I can unite forces. All that stuff I said about you in the past was just tongue in cheek. I was just having a laugh. You’re my mate, innit!
    So please do not give him his page on your fabulous, enthralling and captivating blog.

  73. “Yeah but no but, innit…”

    No garbage from Dannenbaum will ever be published at DYWP, of this Squire, you can rest assured…

  74. what was that saying about people who never miss a chance to miss a chance ???

    could it be owed to too strictly adhering to the teachings of the brillant Gideon Levy, expert on Bertold Brecht unsurpassable.

    also I keep recommending him to make friends with this guy who is a state accredited int’l arms broker (the job has a title I can’t remember) and virulently extending his business who I think by virtue of his mission statements would welcome Gert with open arms
    especially since he is looking for people to improve his English

    Radicals happily alter their faith, morality and principles to suite a political idiology and not the opposite …. why?

    Blootstellen is the name of the blog. In all likelihood it means exposing naked – I thought the promise of nakedness would appeal to Gert but it hasn’t so far and that even though I haven’t come across any buddy more taylor-made for lacking in playmates Gert he just won’t follow my recommendation to become Donny’s language tutor – Donny’s the name of the host of the blog.

  75. Daniel Marks

    I fear not the unholy Gert-Nick alliance, war makes strange bedfellows and I have no doubt that there are few as strange as the batty Belgian blogger.

    Should I, who urged my Anglo-brethren not to refuse any help even from bodies such as the EDL condemn this unlikely turn of events? Should I who preached not a week ago that, “My enemy’s enemy is my friend.” castigate this latter day The Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact?

    I shall judge this new collusion by its actions rather than by its statements. If the combined talents of Nick and Gert are turned to the furtherance of humanitarian goals, and they and their supporters work towards achieving a freer, kinder, more tolerant world then they have only my blessings of G-d’s speed. If, however, the opposite turns out to be the case I shall be there to reprimand them like the Israelite prophets of old.

    A final word of caution to my bloated, “between jobs”, Bridlingtinian bum buddy. Nick may appear as if butter wouldn’t melt in his mouth today, but forget not that this man was also a sergeant-first-class in one of the most elite paratrooper units in the world. He knows more than a dozen ways to kill a man with his bare hands, perhaps the most lethal being his “fried liver attack”. Do not disappoint him. I knew some of his former bed-fellows who did and, tragically, they are no longer with us to tell their tales.

    Do not forget Barbarossa.

  76. Oouch Daniel! Gert was right when he said you can dish it but cannot take it.
    But I have to admit to understanding very little of the abbreviations and acronyms posted of late. They often have the adverse effect of prolonging comprehension rather than shortening it.

    Gert, do you recall the comedian who did a skit on abbreviating the month of July to Jly (with the strap line – “must have been in one hell of a rush”)?

    “Dannebaum and DYWP.” Before a well-informed source explained that the latter referred to Developing your Web Presence, the closest I could get was the Department of Welfare and Pensions. The Y must have been some kind of red herring to throw off any benefit fraudsters (no subtle dig intended) in the same way as the acronym of Grand National Investigation Department (GNIP) would cunningly draw the scholar of counter-espionage to “potato” rather than “department”.

    Daniel (aka Dannenbaum). Let’s not let the fullness of time embellish war hero stories that never happened, in the way that you misconstrue the occupation as a quick trespass across a country field on a Sunday morning hike.

    Your optimistic yet flagging memory has become crippled by your years. I was a crap soldier – one of the worst in fact to ever don the IDF uniform – yet there was only one lesser than myself – and I’m talking to you baby!!

    I think Gert and I have reached a tacit understanding. I will desist from tempestuous personal assaults while he will acknowledge Israel’s rightful place amongst the nations.

  77. Daniel Marks

    How quickly Gert has abandoned his anti-Zionism for reasons of self interest. What other compromises have been made? Are there secret clauses to this “tacit understanding” that have yet to be revealed to the readers of this excellent blog?

    Has a deal been made between Gertencrap and Niklotov to divide up between them?

    I call upon all men of good will to gird your loins. I call upon Resh, Gamil, Silke to prepare to do combat.

    Let us therefore brace ourselves to our duties, and so bear ourselves, that if the RichardMillett’s Blog lasts for a thousand years, men will still say, This was its finest hour.

  78. Daniel,
    You are one of my oldest friends and I will always love you dearly. However your cynicism and intransigence are the greatest obstacle to a comprehensive political peace settlement in these trouble parts.

    Neither Gert nor myself have any claims to, and let it never be alleged to the contrary. Your veni vidi vici techniques enjoyed by you and your settler friends are not welcome here.

    As for Gert abandoning his anti-Zionism for reasons of self-interest, I recall that you were particularly fond of the writings of Adam Smith so let me quote you the great Scot:
    “Charity, while a virtuous act, could not alone provide the essentials for living. Self-interest was the mechanism that could remedy this shortcoming.” True to Smith’s sentiments, I feel Gert wants to live and wants to embrace life, and if the abandonment of his disagreements with the Jewish state is the price, then it is indeed a small price to pay.

    You may mock our alliance and choose to concoct crass historical similes. But your men that you cite of good will, are few and far between. And as for their loins, they can gird them as much as they like till something very nasty happens, it will not make the smallest dent on this incipient entente which is indeed cordial.

  79. I see that the discourse on this blog has finally reached the sophistication of a Gideon Levy column. As Gideon Levy is way beyond of what my grey cells can grasp I must excuse myself while reminding Gert that he may, no matter how alluring Nick’s embrace may seem to him, find true happiness only at Donny’s blootstellen, where he still seems not to have shown up. But maybe despite Donny’s not offering an e-mail has Gert found one and is already happily exchanging know-how with an int’l arms broker who knows one who deals with the IDF. This little aside only as a reminder to Nick how seduction-proof Gert is.

    and to Daniel the reminder: currently Gert is NOT “in between jobs” he is into projects

    For now I go back to the much much simpler teachings of Paul Berman who has me labouring hard at translating this illumined thought into stuff I can render in my own words paying homage to my adored Miss Marple.

    …claims not to support terrorism; he says he wants to understand terrorism, not justify it. Then he understands terrorism so tenderly he ends up justifying it. And he justifies it so thoroughly he ends up defending it.

  80. Silke,
    While I have nothing but complete admiration for you, and though I do not know who Donny is, and I know nothing of arms deals, I am committed to making this work between new Gert and myself. A leopard may never change its spots, but Gert is no leopard.

    While your reticence vis a vis my extended hand of friendship, has given a new meaning to the term unilateralism, I can only hope that any unilateral steps that the Israeli government may take, will, unlike the Gaza withdrawal, be met with a greater degree of reciprocity from our Palestinian partners.

  81. Who the devil is Donny? You seem quite infatuated with him, Silke, but I call it puppy love.

  82. This is from Donny on a blog I won’t name but he blogs at Blootstellen and I thought that even though the man is too lily-white for my taste he might be to Gert’s taste and provide him with a “wonderful friendship”. (I can’t comment there as it is a non-free speech blog.) But of course now that Gert is swooning in the embrace of Nick he will be lost for the good cause. Gert is of the faithful yelping puppy breed.

    Proscribed Goods Brokers do not buy items and only sell on behalf of companies, they recieve percentages. They also have licenses, are constantly audited and their licenses are limited to certain countries. My license has only four and I can only go up to six countries though I chose not to.

    Technically speaking, arms do not change “owners” as that implies second-hand goods or resale via purchase and selling (dealing). I support the selling of items direct from manufactorers whom are not considered “owners” as they do not use them.

    I’ll be doomed to remember Gert forever as it was he who taught me to do italics.

  83. Gert, do you recall the comedian who did a skit on abbreviating the month of July to Jly (with the strap line – “must have been in one hell of a rush”)?

    No, but I do remember the one about a fly in the ointment, will that do?

    I think Gert and I have reached a tacit understanding. I will desist from tempestuous personal assaults while he will acknowledge Israel’s rightful place amongst the nations.

    Ooo-oor, you’re such a teaeaease!

    This is where words cost a million bucks… Tell you what, squire, drop the ‘rightful’, allow me to say it all under my breath and get the Nazi girl of my back and you’ve got yourself one more smashing deal (which we can all ignore in less than 5 years from now, anyway)! Don’t miss the photo opp!

    Okay, erm… K?

  84. isn’t Gert lovable again today.
    Calling me “girl” – a long time since I was paid that compliment

    thank you Gert, there is no one quite like you 
    in case the last one doesn’t come out properly when posted – it is a heart, which I took the trouble of specially fishing out for darling Gert

  85. Heart:

    It just lacks the arrow with inscription ‘Dannenbaum love Nazi girl’ but you may find such insignia on some trees around Ma’ale Adumim, apparently…

  86. I almost overlooked the other compliment Gert paid me:

    fluent in four languages, in the prime years of manhood thriving Director of two once-upon-a-time companies proud-to-be-a-geek, who knows nothing but HTML-tags, between jobs Gert pleads to I was a crap soldier Nick to get a by his account feeble-minded grey-haired old woman of his back?

    Can there be more elaborate praise???

  87. Gert
    nice heart but as always you are not content with the nicety one accords you but want more
    My heart is on fire for lots of guys and gals – alas you are not one of them – Only writers and to a lesser extent painters and composers have the ability to make my heart go up in eternal flames.

    I thought you’d know how to insert a “Sonderzeichen” here but forgot that you know only HTML tags – but that’s strange because I found it in the same part where symbols for chemical formulas are available – shouldn’t you of all people know how to get them properly inserted in here?

  88. I never heard no nuttin’ about K being a crap soldier! Hold your slanderous tongue, witch!

  89. now this is quite something

    Gert rushing to the defense of Nick

    I don’t know whether it’s implications and use are understood in Anglo-land but here it is

    “da wächst zusammen, was zusammen gehört” =there grows together what belongs together???

  90. Gert
    great news – I just listened to this and I firmly believe, if you practice for a number of years what this Stephen Neale is telling you you might have a chance defeating me without yelling for the help of another male
    I’d be ashamed if I wouldn’t feel up to confronting you on my own

  91. Daniel Marks


    By the way, I thought that a couple of weeks ago you were holding Gert personally responsible for murdering your auntie.

    Has that been forgiven too?

  92. Nick,

    I think I can hear the Evil Dannenbaum squeal in terror! He’s clearly near breaking point… Put the kn*fe in now!

  93. four or rather 5 Israelis have just been executed by Gert’s beloved little can’t-help-themselves darlings

  94. When it comes to kill ratios, the Arab/Israeli ratio has been consistently above 10. In Leb II and OCL Israel excelled to about 100.

  95. Those who oppose the concept of nation states, can legitimately claim to be anti-Zionists with a measured degree of credibility, in the same way as they would be anti-German, anti-English, anti-Belgian and anti everything. But such people do not really exist – not even among the ranks of those radicals who still take the Morning Star.

    Vehemently opposing Israel government policies (such as the above-mentioned Gideon Levy, also the likes of Uri Avneri and Amos Oz) do not make those critics anti-Zionist.

    So yes, I do believe that in most cases, anti-Zionism is a veil for anti-Semitism, whether the holder of these views even consciously believes it or not.

    If this conviction was juxtaposed alongside the mention of the passing of my Auntie Aviva, it was not by chance, rather directed at anyone, Gert included and many Jews for that matter, who would selectively deny the right of self-determination and independence to the Jewish people, while fervently defending that same right to every other nation on earth.

  96. Gert
    by your lousy perfidious dumb idiotic menschenverachtende (humans disdaining) logic the current kill-ratio of Malaria beats all.

  97. Nick:

    Almost eloquently as you put it, your argument relies on a typical Zionist canard: that anti-Zionism is opposed to the existence of the State of Israel. In the overwhelming of cases that is not the case and the critic of Israeli foreign policy is branded with it, so that airheads like lill’ Adam can use a straw man argument.

    […], Gert included and many Jews for that matter, who would selectively deny the right of self-determination and independence to the Jewish people, while fervently defending that same right to every other nation on earth.

    Again, this is not what I do. Israel exists. Calling for its destruction or the magical disappearance of Israeli Jews is stupid.

    I do not believe people have the automatic right to self-determination: claiming they do is facile and highly superficial. I see (for instance) no good reason to grant the Scots independence: they have full rights within the Union. No need to fix something that isn’t broken. The same goes for numerous examples around the globe, past, present and future.

  98. Silke, please fuck off.

  99. So yes, I do believe that in most cases, anti-Zionism is a veil for anti-Semitism, whether the holder of these views even consciously believes it or not.

    By that token most people could be described as ‘unconscious murderers’ too. Though Police, here we come.

  100. Oops, ‘Thought Police’, of course…

  101. Gert
    I hereby award you the crown of being one of the most evil-smelling dirty-minded muddle heads I’ve ever come across
    may you experience in your daily life mani-multi-fold the callousness you dish out to others around here
    may you have to spend days and weeks on end without anybody ever smiling a welcome at you

  102. Silke’s argumentation gets more refined by the syllable…

    ‘Banter’ she can sometimes manage, argumentation not at all…

  103. Gert
    as you are nothing but a copy and paster on your ridiculous blog so around here you are nothing but a Gideon Levy paroquet – but I doubt that even somebody as woolly headed and as punching above his head wannabe cultured one as Levy would descend to your idiocy.

    In the meantime lets hope that the baby was so young that there was no consciousness

  104. Silke, you talk a lot about ‘culture’ (Germans often do) yet come across as vulgar and uninformed. Why is that?

  105. yeah I am so uninformed that adored by you Gideon Levy could prove to me with just one column that he is a grandstander
    that you consider somebody “eminent” who writes about a Brecht piece without obviously the slightest idea what is it about
    compared to the logic of such culture heroes I am indeed uninformed
    by their logic anybody who has actually read the books he/she talks about is a know nothing because in their circles only secondary literature counts.
    BTW I have noticed whenever I rebuked you on anything what we commonly call Bildung you shut up immediately, afraid to get imposed as a know-nothing like your dear friend the Fraudster Ibrahim.

  106. You can stick your ‘Bildung’ where the sun doesn’t shine. How many cultures have to be slapped around the cheek with your nebulous concepts?

    What the Israeli right wing is doing to Brecht is what Far Right Loony tunes always do at some point: try and turn the tables on the Left by expropriating what culturally belongs to the latter. See also the settler person who claimed she was like Rosa Parks, or Glen Beck ‘reclaiming’ the civil rights movement with his ‘Tea Parties’. Dr King was a unifying figure, Beck a vulgar crowd pleaser and conspiracy theorist whose only motive is to try and destroy the Obama presidency…

    And STOP cackling in German, some of us have bad memories… 😉

  107. enough for today

    it is time to mourn the dead
    and yes I hold you Gert and the likes of you to be partially responsible for that baby not getting a chance to see the world

  108. Gert

    Please cease with the expletives to Silke – they are abusive and unbecoming.

    It is hard to debase your argument because I believe the whole lot of it is erroneous.

    1 – You have always declined to expand on your comment that Israel is one of the “colossal mistake nations”. Unless you selectively discriminate against Israel as I believe, please name, but a few, other ones. Please be honest this once and do not ignore this question.

    2 – In what you call my Zionist “canard” you are ignorantly wrong again and the complete opposite is the case. Think about it again plainly and simply. Most anti-Zionists do oppose the existence of the state of Israel. If you think a lone voice in Bridlington and a couple of hundred in Covent Garden (of reluctantly de facto Israel-accepting anti-Zionists) can counter the hundreds of millions of belligerent anti-Zionists in Palestine, Middle East, Moslem Africa, Indonesia Malaysia, Pakistan etc. then you should sue your maths teacher or take a clear and hard look at your own motives.

    3 – Do the Kurds deserve independence – what about the Basques – or the Tamils – if the Scottish or Welsh assembly voted for full independence should England permit them to secede or should war be declared?

    I just turned 50 eighteen minutes ago – cheers!

  109. Happy birthday Nick
    may a long contented happy satisfying whatever you favour life await you

    I remember 50 is a great landmark
    so much ballast could be discarded and so much concentrating on really good stuff could take place
    never mind if that sounds mysterious to you now, look back on it in 10 years from now and you’ll understand
    heartfelt blessings to you with all the mental power I can muster

  110. I heard about the massacre while teaching because a fellow lecturer lives to the North of Hebron nearby. My sister Sara lives there too so on the way home I called her. She knew them all.

    Apparently, after shooting at the vehicle the murderers got out of their car and finished off the job from short range. I suspect that these monsters might also have explained that they’re anti-Zionists rather than just anti-Semites. It’s so much more PC these days.

    One of the victims was a righteous proselyte. She was not born a Jew, but she died as one. She left seven children. What should be our prayer for them?

    May they grow up to be strong, proud G-d-fearing Jews and Zionists, like their parents.

    May they find a different way to sanctify G-d’s name.

    May nothing ever cause them to hate “all Arabs” or all anything.

    May they never despair from the belief that one day peace will come.

    May the Lord comfort them with the others of us who mourn for Zion and Jerusalem, and may they know mo more sorrow.

  111. Gert, you are a clueless moron.

  112. Adam,
    As I eagerly await Gert’s honest response to my above questions, I must take issue with your last posting the contents of which I reproduce below:

    “Gert, you are a clueless moron”

    Is not a moron by definition clueless? – in which case is your moron not an oxymoron?

    Indeed it is not – since an oxymoron puts emphasis on the contradictory rather than on the complimentary – like Art Vandelay’s imports over exports – for the consumers of fine comedy.

    It is this type of dilemma, which keeps me up at nights.

  113. Nick:

    Re. your comment of Aug 31, 9.21 pm:

    I will stop ALL name calling when EVERYBODY else does the same. You are in no position to cast stones.

    1- Wrong! You hardly gave me a chance and resorted to abundant ridiculing.

    Creating Israel was a colossal mistake because 60 years onwards the trouble continues. There is no realistic prospect for peace in sight.

    For other examples think failed states and/or long standing conflicts. Pakistan and Bangladesh are typical examples of partitioning gone bad. Both are essentially failed states.

    The partitioning of Ireland into the Republic and Northern Ireland is a problem that remains troublesome.

    Eritrea is often dubbed the ‘North Korea of Africa’. It’s an offshoot from Ethiopia.

    The partitioning of Cyprus.

    Many present/future African attempts at secession/partitioning will lead to genocide and failed states.

    2- Wrong! With a mindset of ‘half the world wants us destroyed!’ I’m not surprised you end up with ludicrous ideas. I can’t further comment on that point: it’s an entirely false premise.

    3- It’s not a question of ‘deserving’ statehood: statehood independence or self-determination (no matter what you want to call it) isn’t a cookie we hand out for good behaviour. Creating Nation States nearly always has severe unintended consequences. It’s better to solve real or alleged problems of inequality, discrimination and such like, rather than resort to the bluntest tool of nation building. For an independent Kurdistan, you need to slice territory off from at least 4 other existing nation States, a recipe for almost infinite trouble! Tamils? Solve these problems of discrimination and go in peace! Basques? Even the Basques don’t want independence, only about 5 ETA guys do so! The Scottish question won’t be resolved by war: it looks like even the SNP are afraid to hold the referendum, scared that they might lose the thing!

  114. for Gert from Silke

    I thought this line I heard today might speak to you so I fished for it – alas I don’t know the whole poem so the context may not be right

    “Wrung with the wounds which kill not, but ne’er heal”

    I hold dear another one again with the qualification that the context may not be right

    “Mine were my faults, and mine be their reward”

  115. They just struck again, another drive-by shooting. Thank G-d nobody was killed this time.

    2 injured one light one critical

  116. to make it vivid for ignorants here is a guy telling how it is to suffer a drive-by shooting
    I don’t know how to produce a link to the video itself it is the one where David Rubin is talking.